Wednesday, December 11, 2013

The Dinar has Revalued

Hundreds of thousands of people have been waiting for the dinar to revalue over the past ten years.  Perhaps millions.  Many have given up, sold their dinar and moved on.  But just like like P.T. Barnum is quoted as saying, there's a sucker born every minute and two to take him.  When one person exits the dinar "investment" it seems that there's always somebody new to take their place, and plenty of scammers to service the RV dreams of the newbie. 

The fact is the dinar has already revalued.  No, I'm not doing the guru "intel" thing where they say we're just waiting on the activation.  I'm going by established and verifiable facts.  In the following chart you can see that there was a substantial increase in the value of about 20% from Nov.1, 2006 to Jan. 2, 2009.  That was an increase of about 9% a year.  (Chart is taken from XE.com)  The CBI parted from their policy of exchange rate stability for 26 months and went to a crawling peg regime as a means of reducing the rate of inflation.  They then returned to their policy of stability and have followed that policy for five years now.

(These charts show the rate of currency vs. the USD so as the line descends the value is increasing.  I tried to make it simpler by using the inverse but the charts didn't display right.)





(12-18-2013  UPDATE!!!  I took the figure of 20% from the US Treasury document I've cited in the past, but according to the XE chart it's closer to a 26% increase.  The point I'm making in this post isn't affected by the 6% difference, but I always try to be as factual as possible and felt obligated to address this.  Whether it's 20% or 26% though, it was a big revaluation and a greater one is extremely unlikely.)


Another revaluation that received a lot of attention in recent years was that of the India rupee.  From July of 2006 to January of 2008 it too increased in value about 20%.  XE Chart



This is typically how major revaluations are carried out.  When I asked currency expert John Jagerson about the largest revaluation in history in my first interview with him two years ago, he responded that it was the ongoing revaluation of the Chinese yuon which at that time had revalued at about 30% since July of 2005.  In the two years since that interview the yuon has added another 5% against the USD for a total revaluation of 35% or so over an eight year period. 

http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=USD&to=CNY&view=10Y




That's an increase of about 4.1% per year, and it's the largest RV in history.  Think about that for a minute.  If the largest RV in history only yielded an increase of 4.1% a year, and the RV of the IQD yielded about 9% a year, why would anybody expect a return of 100,000% or more with the IQD now?  The increase from 2006 to 2009 was huge as far as currencies go.  If you got in early and didn't pay too much of a markup you might have made a few bucks.  But if you bought after Jan. 1, 2009 you missed it.  I missed it, too.  I never even heard of the dinar until after the RV took place. 

The dinar community has been sold a bill of goods.  They've been convinced that a revaluation of impossible magnitude is forthcoming.  It's not.  The big revaluation has already occurred.  They have now stabilized the exchange rate and the focus is on redenomination rather than revaluation.  All of the articles talking about deleting the zeros or removing the zeros are talking about redenomination, not revaluation.  Their focus is now on replacing the IQD with a new dinar and demonetizing the IQD.  The dinar community calls that a lop, and like it or not that's the CBI's stated plan for the IQD.  When it will happen I can't say.  It might never happen for all we know.  But whether they lop or not, to expect any increase beyond the one from 2006-2009 is wishful thinking. 


And to our friend Dinarbeleiver (who seems to confuse billions with trillions), if you're saying that a country's M2 doesn't prevent them from revaluing their currency I actually agree.  If Iraq wanted to start bumping the value up less than 1% a month like they did from 2006-2009 I'm sure they could do that by simply stabilizing the M2 while their reserves grow.  They could certainly raise the value 4.1% a year like China has with that approach.  The question is why would they want to?  What would they accomplish by doing that?  China raised the value because of international pressure.  Iraq raised the value to combat inflation.  Neither one of those are factors with Iraq today.  But if you're saying what you appear to be saying that the M2 is irrelevant I would ask how you draw that conclusion from anything discussed here?  Nobody here said that Iraq isn't capable of increasing the value in the sense of a conventional revaluation of a few % here and there.  The consensus here is that Iraq isn't capable of revaluing to an extent that would make anybody rich, and nothing in any previous revaluation would contradict that.  Cheers!




 

166 comments:

  1. Interesting Sam but how many times have we heard on the Dum ,,,,,errr, Dinar forums "Well the Chinese lied and denied they were going to "RV" right up until the day before they did it"!

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    1. I'd glad you brought that up, dwm. First of all, the story about China taking out a full page ad denying that they would RV the day before the RV is BS. The RV wasn't done in a day. It's a process that has been ongoing now for over eight years as I showed above. What actually happened is that an English version of a Chinese news website stated that they would revalue at a certain time and Chinese central bank officials denied giving any time frame. It was a dispute over when a revaluation would begin, not a denial of their intent.

      Market Watch
      China Daily

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    2. Yep it's become a popular "forum fact" that's often used to convince the ignorant that Iraq is lying about the up-coming "RV" but so far no one has been able to point out just when that day was!, I have tried in vain to convince a couple of people that there was no overnight "RV" in China but both insist that China just lied and denied right up until the day before it happened, the "force of the Dark Side is strong", is it not?

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    3. Just to clarify, there was a denial of intent to RV in 2005 as a Chinese official said that they were quite content with a stable exchange rate. Then in 2006 US congressmen met with Chinese officials and informed them of pending legislation to impose tariffs on Chinese imports. At that point China relented and agreed to start adjusting their currency's value. Again, their denial at this point was about when, not if they would revalue. How that morphed into the apocryphal "full page ad" story we can only attribute to dinar pumpitude.

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    4. dwm, I suppose that if China lied about RV'ing then they are also lying about buying up everyone's dinar via the 800#, Wells Fargo, or whatever other BS story the pumpers keep using in the forums about Madame Wu. LOL... Again, it's their mentality that the only truth in the dinar investment is the storyline they fabricate. Unbelievable.

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    5. and i clicked on that link and see "ol poopy is still at it. and isn't he kind of old to be calling people PEEPS......what a know nothing!

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    6. "Madame Wu". ROFL. For those who don't know, the absurd "White Hats" who keep pumping the global settlements / NESARA claimed she died years in 2007 (amazing trick given she was still First Vice Premier of China from June 2007 to March 2008, LOL) promptly reinvented her again in 2011 "White Hat" reports and see no credibility problem with that:-

      "And let's not forget the executed Madame Wu Yi... Upon discovery, Madame Wu Yi faced a long interrogation before she was allowed to die." - APRIL 2009
      http://www.fourwinds10.com/siterun_data/government/new_world_order/news.php?q=1240178122
      (Health warning : Above website will rot your brain...)

      "Major efforts are in play this week again with large support staff having just been flown in by Madam Wu and the Admiral." - "White Hat reports" AUGUST 2012

      This bunch of posers all pretending to be "secret agents" in order to gain "followings" can't even keep track of the lies they told 4 years ago...

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  2. Countries always deny they are going to raise their exchange rate even if it's a quarter of 1%. That's why it blows my mind that there are actually idiots out there who think the 100's of remove 3 zero articles are Iraq announcing a 100,000% RV.

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  3. A brain adequately lubricated on Koolaid might also look at the charts and going to xe.com to look at the specifics, notice that the IQD went from 0.31 IQD per 1 USD on May 11tth, 2004 to 1454 IQD per 1 USD the following day. So why can't what goes down in a single step come back in a similar fashion?

    This data is present on a number of currency sites and is country to the CBI's own history page describing the dinar reaching 3000 IQD per 1 USD by the mind 90s. Oanada.com was an exception but they don't show (at least for free) history back to this date anymore. What this shows I suspect is the rate Saddam officially claimed up to the point that regular CBI data was available staring in 2004. When they restarted the economy after the completion of the 4 month Bremmer exchange, the exchange rate was (technically speaking) RV'd by 100% from 3000 / 1 to ~1450 to 1. Oaanda used to show this. This was possible since there was no functioning economy to disrupt and once they knew just how big the money supply was (by the Bremmer exchange) they had sufficient foreign reserves (perhaps with some US bolstering) to start the economy out at a higher rate.

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  4. The Info is right on the CBI website. Saddam didn't allow the CBI to publish any info during his reign. That's one of the reason no one honored their currency and his dictated exchange rate.

    Here...from the CBI:
    The Department of Research & Statistics publishes statistical information about various Iraqi economic activities. This information is provided to researchers and economists for analysis. All this is based on quarterly bulletins and the annual reports which the Central Bank of Iraq issues. The negative conditions that the country experienced and the harsh constraints on publishing any information imposed by the previous regime caused the Central Bank to halt its publications, hence reducing its statistical and research activities.

    At present with the end of these circumstances and with the desire of the Central Bank to have full transparency, the environment has become conducive for conducting research and publishing relevant information in a timely manner.

    On this occasion, the Department of Research & Statistics is pleased to publish this special Issue of the Statistical Bulletin of the Central Bank of Iraq providing information available for the period of 1991 through June 2003. This is the starting point for a regular publication of the Annual Bulletin on the economy of the new Iraq.
    http://www.cbi.iq/documents/Annual_2002f.pdf

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    1. And from that document you can see in 1991, the first year they report, Iraq had a M2 of 24.6 Billion. It was 10 Iraqi dinar to 1 dollar. Or 10 cents per dinar.

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  5. Good work, guys. You won't find information like this in the forums. I want all of the regular contributors to this blog to know how much I appreciate your thoughts and support. You're the best!

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  7. And speaking of times past in Iraq. Adam Montana says in todays chat "Iraq as a whole would benefit greatly, both financially and emotionally, from a return to their former prosperity. "
    http://webwarper.net/ww/~av/dinarvets.com/forums/index.php?/topic/167502-december-11-weekly-qa/

    "former prosperity"? Really? GDP is over 4x what it was in Saddam's best years (80 and 89 where GDP was nearly 50B in current USD), GDP per capita is more than 2x the 1980 peak
    (source http://databank.worldbank.org/data/views/reports/chart.aspx#) .
    During the 90s things just got worse of course, but even during the legitimate high exchange rate times, economically Iraqi's were worse off than today (one might argue that the streets were safer then, but not that people had more money). Just as the size of the money supply alone does not tell you how the exchange rate is constrained (as we tried to tell DB), just the exchange rate alone does not tell you about the wealth of the country and its people. Iraq's "former prosperity", yet another pumper myth.

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  8. Very clever, Sam. Having a headline like that will surely get a few dinarians to visit the blog.

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    1. Ya think? Actually I"m just trying to inform people as to what a major revaluation really looks like. They don't go from less than a penny to a dollar at the flip of a switch. Even a 20% increase takes a year or two.

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    2. Are you kidding networth. All I did was read the title of the article then immediately ran out to get a collateral loan before I place an order for 20 million dinar hoping I could get in last minute expecting that I beat the rv before it made it to the west coast. We all know that the rv travels with the time zones from east to west and is not complete until the banks close in Hawaii. I should be at the banks by 9am tomorrow morning even before my dinar arrives at home. Perhaps I can get FedEx to meet me at the bank line. I'll give him a 25k note tip which will be $75k for 5 minutes worth of work. Where in this world can you make $15k/ min. LOL...

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    3. Of all the stupidity associated with the Dinar scam the one thing that amazes me most is people rushing to dealers for last minute buys (I won't even get into buying Dinar on option, that's just so incredibly dumb that stupid is not the right word for it!!) on the "latest news" that "the RV" is imminent or has already happened! Duhhh,,,,,,let's see now "the RV" has already happened or it's sure to happen "tomorrow" but the dealers are still willing to sell me all the millions of Dinar I want for the same price it was before the "news" broke? Sure they would!!!!!!

      What are these people thinking??

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    4. What? Vinny, you didn't buy on reserve?? You could have "gotten" 10x as may IQD! What were you thinking!!

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    5. Damn it, jrg... I didn't think of that. I guess I was just being greedy a tad thinking about how I could change this nation with the mega millions. ;-)

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    6. I never bought on reserve but I must confess I bought once on what I heard in a conference call. Yeah, I've been there.

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  9. I said buy on "option" when I meant to say reserve but I suppose it's the same thing, it's just reserve is what the dealers and dreamers usually call it.

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    1. dwm... either way you are correct because buying on "reserves" is a stupid "option". the only thing reserved is the poor suckers money in the dealers coffits. lol

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    2. About a year ago (wife in the know) showed up on recaps out of the blue. I let her convince me to buy more. I bought it from a dealer and was lucky enough to get most of my money back. Unfortunately the dinar that I bought from the bank a few years ago is what I am having a hard time getting rid of.

      Sam, I think you are doing a great job! The comments are getting higher every week. You are getting closer to Okie and Tony everyday.lol. Keep up the good work!!

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  10. Several years ago when my cousin first got into this and was trying to convince me he had me listen in on a conference call that almost had me hooked (don't even remember who the scammers were since I didn't recognize any of them at the time). They almost got me with that famous line about "what if it happens and you waited too long, how are you going to feel when you get left out?" but then one of them, supposedly from Australia, started in about how it was our president that was the hold up and that Bush/Chaney hatched this plan and they had pallets of Dinar stacked in a small bunker in Texas, that lit up the red lights! I started to research on the 'net but at that time most of what could be found was pumper generated BS that overwhelmed the true facts however enough digging turned up the truth, that along with my normally skeptical thinking was enough to convince me that this was indeed a scam but in those days it was much easier to fall for it. Skip forward to today, the truth is like a flashing red light with a warning whistle! Guys like Sam have done a wonderful job of exposing this non-sense and that along with numerous easily found articles from real professionals with real and verifiable information makes the truth about this quite clear! These days a person has to literally hide from the truth to fall for this non-sense and it's not like it was at the beginning, in those days it was terribly lop sided in favor of the scammers but today a potential victim has to intentionally ignore the very obvious facts in order to be taken in but sadly far too many do just that!

    I truly believe that then and now the most powerful tool the scammers have is the "what if" question and in most cases they don't even have to ask since the victim will naturally ask it of him/herself. "What if this really does happen and you miss out?" has probably sold more Dinar than any other sales pitch and while it may seem like a logical question it's actually quite illogical to ask "what if" about an event that is 100% impossible in the first place! I suppose all of us would be extremely upset with ourselves if we woke up one morning to find that the Iraqi Dinar that we did not buy had suddenly become worth 1000 to 3000 times the value that we passed it up for but since there is absolutely ZERO chance of finding ourselves in that predicament it's a situation that's simply illogical to even contemplate!

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  11. The Iraqi dinar will become world tradeable http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/scr/2013/cr13217.pdf

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    1. Which has nothing whatsoever to do with your imaginary "RV"...

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  12. The de facto fixed exchange rate has served Iraq well. The authorities agreed that a stable nominal exchange rate provides a valuable anchor for inflation expectations in an uncertain environment, and intend to continue implementing this policy for the foreseeable future. In the medium term, staff encouraged the authorities to consider creating the conditions which would make possible a move to a more flexible exchange rate policy. Such flexibility could allow a predictable and gradual appreciation of the nominal exchange rate, triggered by strong oil revenues and the Balassa-Samuelson effect, to accommodate a possible real exchange rate appreciation while keeping domestic inflation low.

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    1. Foreseeable Future = Probably 5 years
      Medium Term = 5-10 years
      Translation: The CBI will probably continue their policy of exchange rate stability for the next few years. After that they might want to consider going to a more flexible policy that would allow the dinar's value to gradually appreciate a few % a year. By that time the IQD will most likely have been replaced in the planned redenomination.

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  13. 16. In contrast, staff recommended liberalizing the foreign exchange market and improving the AML/CFT regime. Staff noted that effectively limiting supply might be inconsistent with a de facto fixed exchange rate regime. The CBI has ample international reserves to maintain the de facto peg. Furthermore, AML/CFT standards do not contemplate ex-ante controls on foreign currency transactions, but focus on customer due diligence and reporting suspicious transactions to an operational and fully independent Financial Intelligence Unit. In staff’s view, accelerating the liberalization of payments for current transactions would therefore be the best approach to eliminating distortions in the foreign exchange market, the exchange rate spread, and the rents it creates. It would also allow removing the exchange restrictions and
    the multiple currency practice, with a view to accepting the obligations under Article VIII. The improvement of the AML/CFT framework, in line with the MENA-Financial Action Task Force (FATF) recommendations, and FATF standards, together with the ongoing efforts in strengthening AML/CFT supervision by the CBI, would help address money laundering and terrorism financing concer

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    1. Yes maintaining the peg at its current rate as the full document you quoted said. The paragraph you quoted above was also about combating money laundering. As usual, you "pretend" it "must really mean" a 300,000% RV out of personal desperation.

      A few days ago you ran away from the other thread after getting totally thrashed on every single point of every single subject you brought up. Since then you've churned out a load of garbage on Dinar Vets somehow managing to make a complete fool of yourself getting all your maths wrong by a factor of 1,000 (and you claimed to be an "expert mathematician"). Even people on DinarVets were openly laughing at you and commenting on your increasingly unhinged mental state. Examples:-

      Dinarbeliever - "Czech Republic current M2 3195472 billion"

      Dinarbeliever - "Canada has an m2 of 1225287.00 billion"

      As explained to you here, back in the real world, the so called "billion" you invented from your trading economic links, clearly states "million" ("CZ MN", "CAD Million"):-

      "Money Supply M2 in Czech Republic increased to 3195472.50 CZK MN". 3,195bn CZ money supply @ 20:1 rate = a money supply of just $159bn. Not $159,000bn as you falsely claimed. It's dozens of times SMALLER than Iraq not "hundreds of times" larger. And is 1,729x smaller than your delusional 275,000% "RV" figure which itself is over 3.5x larger than the whole global economy (ie, a mathematical impossibility). Anyone can verify your errors for themselves here:-
      http://www.tradingeconomics.com/czech-republic/money-supply-m2

      The Czech Koruna & CAD are also floating currencies not a pegged one (as at least three people pointed out to you, but you ignored them both because it didn't fit in well with your fantasy and you simply didn't understand what people were saying but think you "know it all" and tried and failed miserably to show off in front of your friends).

      This debate isn't even sane anymore (not that it ever was) when you tell such blatantly stupid & obvious lies like that, then spend days talking to yourself flailing around in a frantic confused state trying to prove everyone else "wrong" by scribbling in 3 extra zero's to everyone else's currency and yell the same lies over and over again hoping to make them become true. LOL.

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    2. Good grief DB, you didn't even (I'm betting) go to the actual source of this but just cut and pasted it from all the various dinar forums that have posted it somehow thinking that "liberalizing the foreign exchange market" is some how RV-ish. Of course its not. Here is the actual report form the IMF in July 2013 http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/scr/2013/cr13217.pdf . And here are their summary (note nothing about raising the exchange rate at all).

      "Outlook: The positive trend in oil production and exports contrasts with the weakening economic governance deriving from an increasingly difficult political process and worsening security. The authorities will be able to fend off the danger of the natural resource curse if they can improve political and security conditions, strengthen economic institutions, and implement sound policies. Fiscal policies should aim at financing the needed social and investment spending while building up adequate fiscal buffers to insulate the economy from oil market shocks. On the back of large oil exports, strong current account performance is expected to result in the accumulation of international reserves.

      Main policy recommendations: The authorities need to be proactive in addressing medium-term challenges and risks by: (a) ensuring fiscal sustainability and building fiscal buffers to address volatility in oil revenues; (b) stepping up the liberalization of the foreign exchange market; (c) continuing the prudent management of reserves held by the Central Bank of Iraq and the Development Fund for Iraq; (d) deepening the reform of the financial sector, including the creation of a level playing-field for private banks; and (e) accelerating structural reform to promote private sector growth and employment creation."

      Note AML is Anti-Money-Laundering and CFT is Combating-Financing-of-Terrorism . No RV.

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    3. Read page 17 paragraph 14 of the document. It's not from guru stuff +1 for me

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    4. Dinarbeliever - "Read page 17 paragraph 14 of the document. It's not from guru stuff +1 for me"

      What, you mean the one that says Iraq intend to maintain they're current peg for the foreseeable future? Goodness me, what more startling "proof of the imminent RV" could we possible need? That in itself actually totally debunks all these guru's running round predicting "imminent RV" - like YOU:-

      "6-1-13 DinarBeliever: I used to think it would not happen overnight. But now recently I firmly believe it will happen overnight and I will go out on a limb here before 8th July 2013".

      Your above "proof", is yet another example of pumper "kool-aid" induced hallucinations when you start seeing things that aren't there... The "gradual appreciation of the nominal exchange rate means exactly what Sam has already explained to you - 1% per year here, 2% per year there. That's less that what you'd get putting your money in a savings account. You're living in a world of your own if you think that means an impossible 275,000% "RV". The fantasy you keep shoveling is indeed "guru stuff". You're just cherry picking quotes that say the exact opposite of what you think they do, and trying to twist them to suit your fantasy as some form of emotional comfort blanket, then screaming "I'm right! I'm right!" like a lunatic...

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  14. That's not even a good try there DB, a few days ago you were at a total loss and even asking these guys what M0, M1, and M2 actually meant then you crawled back over to DV and tried to pretend to be an expert on the subject! Man give it up! Don't you have any pride at all? You simply copy/paste something you found that you very obviously don't even begin to understand and you think you are going to come across as knowledgeable? You are going to have to do a lot better than that!


    You bragged in one of your posts over at DV that you had "stirred up a bit of a hornets' nest" over here, you think you stirred up a hornets' nest????? Lol, you just left here with everyone laughing at you and you can't even see the difference! What happened to all your buddies over at DV? You think they didn't see your little performance here?

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  15. I don't care what people think of me but its funny to see you guys attack - better than watching TV lol read page 17 paragraph 14

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  16. I never said it meant an RV overnight but the document supports an increase in value over time

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  17. Can we agree that the document supports the idea of increasing the exchange rate

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    1. I will concede that the IMF is suggesting to the CBI that they consider going to a more flexible exchange rate policy in a few years that will allow a gradual appreciation, but as I've already pointed out a 20% increase would take years. By your own stated time frame of three years before the appreciation begins we're looking at five years before most dinar speculators break even IF they don't lop first.

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  18. Can we all please agree that the document supports an increase of the exchange rate

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    1. No clearly does not. What it supports is moving to a more flexible exchange rate policy so as to be able to accommodate a POSSIBLE increase in the exchange rate. And even if all that occurs (i.e. their fears expressed in the summary about security etc are dealt with) they are talking about very modest increases and over years.

      "14. The de facto fixed exchange rate has served Iraq well. The authorities agreed that a stable nominal exchange rate provides a valuable anchor for inflation expectations in an uncertain environment, and intend to continue implementing this policy for the foreseeable future. In the medium term, staff encouraged the authorities to consider creating the conditions which would make possible a move to a more flexible exchange rate policy. Such flexibility could allow a predictable and gradual appreciation of the nominal exchange rate, triggered by strong oil revenues and the Balassa-Samuelson effect, to accommodate a possible real exchange rate appreciation while keeping domestic inflation low."

      Where do you get that the IQD is "severely undervalued "? Its valued just as their reserves and money supply dictate, with about 15% headroom. There is absolutely nothing in that doc (or any other that I know of) to support any such idea. -1 for you.

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    2. Ironically, the same IMF he links to already debunks him on that too:-

      "A report on Monday by the International Monetary Fund (IMF) suggests that the Iraqi dinar is currently fairly valued at 1170 dinars to the US dollar:"
      http://www.iraq-businessnews.com/2011/03/30/imf-suggests-stable-iraqi-dinar/

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  19. In finance or financial operations of borrowing and investing, what is considered long-term is usually above 3 years, with medium-term usually between 1 and 3 years and short-term usually under 1 year. So Sam I am I think from this medium term is no longer than 3 years. I think something is about to happen to the currency soon ( I'm not going to say lop or RV, float) in line with Iraqs 5 year plan. I think this investment is coming to an end soon. Until then we don't know what will happen

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  20. I am gonna hang out with you guys from now on as well as dinar vets. I will post stuff on here and get your opinions. I am not going to post shit but stuff from reputable sites like the IMF link. I stand by this though -Iraqs currency is severely undervalued and if they change that peg and float it on the forex - we could witness some major movement that is unprecedented. I know you guys won't accept that statement be cause it had never happened before but I doubt there has been a situation where a countries currency is deemed severely undervalued. If I spot any decent stuff to support myself I will. I am going to stop the children act. I will post on here and get your views but I am no longer going to look at scoring points against the opposition

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    1. You are welcome to participate here as long as you act like an adult. I've told my regular readers to remain civil and now I'm going to tell you to knock off the trolling. If you really want us to educate you as you stated previously, we're willing to try. But if you are just here to agitate and then run back to DV and beat your chest I'm not sure how long my patience will hold out.

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    2. That's fair enough Sam. I will not be looking to troll here or score points. I will however post certain statements off reputable sites and Iraqi TV and just see your opinion. By the way okie is lying about what was said on Iraqi TV

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    3. DB says, "-Iraqs currency is severely undervalued"

      Now would you care to explain just why you think it's undervalued? You have yet to answer a single question and I think we all know why so why don't you prove us all wrong and show us just how much you really know by explaining how the Iraqi Dinar is undervalued?

      I'll give you a hint, it's exchange rate against the dollar is not what determines whether it's undervalued or not.

      As far as it rising in value it certainly can and I don't think anyone here would say it won't (of course it could also just easily go down), it's just how much and how fast it rises that is in question. Well actually it's not really a question, not long ago it went from 1170 to 1166 and that's the kind of changes that can be expected -only small amounts over relatively long periods of time.

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    4. dwm009 - "Now would you care to explain just why you think it's undervalued? You have yet to answer a single question and I think we all know why"

      This is why I still believe he's trolling. On the other thread, he appeared to give the impression of wanting a grown-up discussion towards the end, whilst simultaneously posting almost childlike things over on DV ("amateur hour lol", "kiss my bottom", "I am gonna teach you good", "I will whoop you") of the same sort usually coming from insecure teenagers on Youtube, and now returns trying to pretend he's 'Mr. Mature' and the "victim" of something or other. I think his underlying intention and 'playing two sides of the fence off each other' style of posting are pretty clear.

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    5. You're probably right but IMO it has backfired on him, he has not only come across as a total,,,,,,well you know, but it seems he has lost his creditability over at DV. In addition all the effort some of you guys have gone to has done far more than just show him up for how little he really knows because I am sure some of those at DV have been lured over here to witness this little exchange only to see some of their favorite myths thoroughly debunked!

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  21. No we cannot agree to that Dinarbeliever because it doesn't. The IMF would like for Iraq to change its monetary policy but even the IMF knows and have openly stated that Iraq will remain pegged for THE FORSEEABLE FUTURE. That doesn't sound too good for your magic float up to 3. LOL.........Iraq is simply WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYYYYYYY too unstable to even dare attempt to float their currency. It would surely be disastrous. Who really wants dinar anyway besides Not-so-Breitling and KraperPony victims? Iraqis don't even want it. Maybe you haven't noticed Dinarbeliever but Iraq is a hot zone of murder, bombings, corruption, and poverty. Yeah....really great currency to float on the open market. Even if Iraq were stable their exchange rate could not skyrocket to make you rich anyway. Its a complete impossibility in economics. You would know that if you understood the principles of inflation at all (which you don't). So keep on coming with irrelevant wishful thinking articles that mean absolutely nothing about a "RV" which is purely made up fantasy by scam artist years ago on the internet. I read your buddy 4aProfit over at DV state that Iraq is going to be a donor nation which is "huge" so they should be able to join the WTO right away. ROFLMAO..........The irrelevance is absolutely hilarious. Hype at its finest.

    DMW......good post earlier. You are right.....it is silly to dwell on what if because there isn't if. If doesn't exist in this case.

    Say I went up to my uncle and said......hey.....I need you to buy as much Canadian Dollar as you can afford because it is about to increase in value by 1000 times? He would look at me and laugh and proceed to tell me that currency doesn't work that way. BUT.........if I told him.....hey.........have you heard about the Iraqi Dinar? And then spouted off a bunch of lies like....Its been purposefully undervalued by the illuminati to make them richer by an increase. Iraq has the most oil ever...in the whole world.....they are super wealthy.......Hillary said their economy will surpass Chinas.......Bush and Cheney hatched the "plan" long ago........the US Treasury is going to buy all your dinar after the "RV". You get the point. After all of that a giant increase in Iraqs currency value makes sense. Especially if you don't understand how currency works. (I didn't when I first got involved in this scam) Then my uncle starts listening to conference calls by professional liars like Breitling and the excitement grows. Then he gets involved on a feel good high five censor forum like DV with paid hype creators running around spreading more lies. Then scam defenders like Caz will constantly attack any "negativity" while irrelevant "news" out of Iraq is posted daily keeping the illusion alive like something "big" might happen any day now. All of this creates a perfect storm of hype and illusion to create the perfect scam of the Iraqi Dinar "RV". The whole scam was started long ago utilizing illusion and ignorance. I have to hand it to the original creators of the scam. They were smart and knew exactly how to play on peoples emotions.

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    1. Hillary Clinton actually quoted the IMF and stated that Iraq will grow faster and stronger than china. I can post her saying that at a conference if you don't believe it

      Delete
    2. Yes, Hillary said that. Nobody here will deny that. But it has nothing to do with any increase in the value of the dinar. Libya's GDP doubled in 2012 but their currency's value remained fairly stable. Vietnam's GDP has gone from $40b to $140b in the last ten years but the dong has consistently lost value. I wrote about that recently in Currency Is Not Stock As for the dinar being undervalued, the IMF said The low level and the relative stability of inflation do not suggest any significant over- or undervaluation of the Iraqi dinar." (page 10)

      Delete
    3. Actually Sam no she did not!, Clinton said,


      " Iraq poses significant opportunities for American companies. The International Monetary Fund has projected for Iraq to grow faster than China over the next two years",

      But true to Dinarbeleiver's Dinar Dreamer induced comprehension difficulties he sees "to grow faster than China over the next two years" as, will grow faster [AND STRONGER] than china.

      So DB is saying that Clinton said Iraq will grow STRONGER than China in just two years???? LOL, How many years has it been since she supposedly said that DB? What happened to Iraq's economy in the last two years? Are they becoming an economic superpower that rivals China and we are somehow missing it? Even if they are (Yeah, SURE they are, Lol!!) that still does not translate into a stronger exchange rate! DB take a look at South Korea's economy and tell us what you see, South Korea's economy absolutely DWARFS Iraq's but strangely (strange to those blinded by Dinar fever anyway) South Korea's economy skyrocketed in the last fifty years but the Won did not, even with a robust economy like that the Won exchanges to the Dollar very closely to the same as the Dinar, would you care to explain why this is?

      DB is giving us a classic example of Dinar Dreaming (or pumping as I am beginning to suspect), Dinar Dreamers and pumpers simply take a legitimate quote and add/subtract words (this time he conveniently added "and stronger" which she did not say) or even complete sentences or otherwise rearrange what was actually said in order to make it mean what they want it mean, usually just the opposite of it's true meaning! In this case Clinton is not only talking about growth RATE but the rest of what she said very clearly is about business investments and has NOTHING to do with speculating in Iraqi currency.

      These guys just don't get it, Iraq's economy compared to China's is a joke and always will be! Sure Iraq could grow it's economy FASTER than China, quite a bit FASTER and that would be good for business investment which is what Clinton was speaking of but it still would take many years for it to approach the SIZE of China's economic power. Of course even that would never happen since that faster RATE of growth could never be maintained long enough to equal China, how could it? They certainly couldn't hope to reach that kind of economic power with oil alone, they can't sell enough oil to do that even if they had enough and quite clearly they are not and NEVER WILL BE an industrial power of any significance (most likely none at all) and certainly not anywhere near China!

      Delete
    4. Dinarck - "I read your buddy 4aProfit over at DV state that Iraq is going to be a donor nation which is "huge" so they should be able to join the WTO right away. ROFLMAO..........The irrelevance is absolutely hilarious. Hype at its finest."

      ROFL!!! "4aprofit" is the nut with serious mental health issues who keeps getting destroyed over on Iraq Business News by pumping "the Dinar RV must be true because of the 'global reset', and some guy will give everyone on Earth $10bn because my secret agent friend said so!" as a result of hanging round the dumbest conspiracy forums all day long. In fact, he was also the same nutjob who claimed "Obama has been in jail since Dec 5th 2012″ (whilst Obama was simultaneously giving a speech on live TV, LOL), and "it must be true" because a stranger told him on the net" :-)

      Reality check : $10bn x 7.4 billion people = $74 quintillion dollars – the equivalent of 985,000x planet Earth’s sized global economies! And apparently, due to a "global reset", there will be no need for economies or trade anymore because every country will have "discovered" the "secret" of "resetting their wealth" by "printing themselves rich" and no-one on Earth will ever have to work again (including doctors, nurses, firefighters, ambulance crews, power station operators, telecoms engineers, farmers, teachers, people who keep ISP’s & satellites running, mailmen, retailers, truckers who deliver food from farmers & factories to supermarkets, airline pilots, refuse collection & highway maintenance staff, water supply & sewage treatment staff, etc", because "everyone, everywhere will retire a billionaire!" Gosh, why didn't anyone think of "printing themselves rich" before? (actually, some did – ask Zimbabwe!)

      This is what "4aprofit" believes. And if "4aprofit" genuinely is the company "Dinarbeliever" keeps, it's "game over" already...

      Delete
    5. dwm09 - "Dinar Dreamers and pumpers simply take a legitimate quote and add/subtract words (this time he conveniently added "and stronger" which she did not say) or even complete sentences or otherwise rearrange what was actually said in order to make it mean what they want it mean, usually just the opposite of it's true meaning"

      Nailed it in one. As for Hilary Clinton's claimed quote has been laughably twisted by the RVaholics to mean "Iraq's economy will be bigger than China". LOL. Meanwhile back in the real world, a percentage increase in the rate of growth is not that difficult when you have nothing nor the same as actual growth. Example:-

      China - 5% growth of a $9tn economy = $450bn growth

      Iraq - 10% growth of a $50bn economy (a few years ago) = $5bn growth

      Despite 10% being "twice as much" as 5%, $5bn absolute growth is 90x smaller and China's $9,000bn economy is 45x larger than Iraq's $200bn today. It's one of those statistics that politicians love to use as it sounds impressive but isn't, and those who are easily fooled lap up in droves as "proof of the RV"... Back in the real world, Iraq will never have an economy anywhere near China's for the same reason Finland's isn't as big as the USA - it's a 50x smaller country. Common sense it seems is the first casualty of Dinar "investing"...

      And as several people have explained to "Dinar Believer" now, currency & economy are two different things. See South Korea, Japan. Reposted from other thread since DinarBeliever ran away from it...

      "It's possible to have a weak currency and strong economy (China, Japan & South Korea), and it's possible to have a strong currency and weak economy (Greece, Portugal, Fiji, Bulgaria, etc). South Korea's economy is +5.5x bigger than Iraq's and their currency is virtually the same value. Why? Because currency isn't a "stock" based on GDP, it's value is based on the amount of currency issued divided by central bank reserves to back it with. South Korea have a strong economy but the Won is worth only 1052:1 because they too have printed over 2 QUADRILLION units of currency.

      All these "RV" morons are doing is running round picking the world's 10 least valued currencies with at 3 zeros after them, then trying to pretend "inflation never really took place, it's all some big conspiracy". Pick up your passport, travel to one of these countries yourself, ask the locals about why the currency fell or about the food prices that doubled each week, and you'll get 1,000% more truth about devalued currencies than you ever will on any childish "Go RV! forum."


      Any response this time around Dinarbeliever, or are you just going to run away again?

      Delete
  22. OK........Really Dinarbeliever? Again with the undervalued nonsense. This is exactly what I was talking about. Confused "investors" that don't have a clue about economics unknowingly spout off lies like "the dinar is undervalued" which creates the illusion for the "RV" which does not and cannot ever exist.

    How many times does it have to be explained to you? The more there is of something in existence the less value it holds. Its simple supply and demand. The very most basic principle of economics and you cannot even grasp that. 85 TRILLLION UNITS IN EXISTENCE. That's 85 million million dinar. Do the math with the reserves they have backing it (Mr mathematician) and you get around 1166 which is it VALUE. Just because you think it should be at 3.00 doesn't mean squat.

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  23. Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha.........you are delirious. Yes Hillary said Iraqs economic GROWTH will surpass Chinas. Of course the dinar forum liars had to spin that to mean whatever backs the "RV" illusion. Chinas economy is already bloated while Iraq has no where to go but up so yeah......their growth might be better than Chinas but lets be serious here. Hillary was just being nice. Iraq has no economy. They have no factories. They have no skilled workers. They have no tech industry. They have oil, camel shit, and sand. Why am I not surprised that you have bought into the lie that Iraq will grow "STRONGER" than China? LOL....... China has a GDP of like 11 trillion which is expected to reach 16 trillion by 2020 and Iraq is going to be "stronger" than that? Hahahaha.......Iraq doesn't even have enough oil to pump to meet that size of a GDP EVER.

    ReplyDelete
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    1. yep it's classic he takes a quote from Hilliary Clinton talking about SHORT TERM RATE of growth and somehow morphs that into Clinton saying that Iraq will be economically STRONGER than China, and in only two years!!!!! Wow, this just gets better and better,

      Delete
  24. Dinarbeliever, if you really want a "serious debate" on your IMF link then here it is:-

    1. On page 11, Iraq's economy is predicted to grow at between 8.3%-9.0% per year from now until 2018. Given say a $200tn economy today, that means by 2018, Iraq should have a $302bn economy. How is a 50% bigger economy going to support a 300,000% (or even a 100%) "RV"? It isn't. How is a $300bn economy going to support a $275,000 RV (or even a $600bn "RV")? It isn't.

    2. On page 11-12, CBI reserves are predicted to increase from $80tn to $103tn by 2018. Meanwhile, Iraq's current account balance is predicted to remain at the same value in 2018 as 2013. Iraq's fiscal balance is predicted to increase by only 1% 2013-2018. Oil prices are even predicted to fall. Meanwhile, "official" inflation continues to rise at 5.5-6.0%, and later in the document it shows predicted money supply growth at same rate as reserve increases (9-11%) which = no real growth in exchange rate. It also means that by 2018, Iraq should have a money supply of approx 118-135tn Dinar and only $104bn CBI reserves.

    Again, how is $103bn CBI reserves in 2018 going to "support" a +118,000bn Dinar money supply in 2018? It sure as hell isn't at 1:1, 10:1, 100:1 or even 1000:1 rates unless they Lop. The rate is yet again 118,000 / 103 = 1145:1 vs the $. Iraq could afford to appreciate the Dinar a few % in real terms over 5 years which = an annual compound interest rate equivalent return on investment of well under 1.0%. You'd get more sticking it in even a 1.00% high street savings account, instead your banknotes just sit there and get eaten away by 6-7% inflation each year whilst you swagger around with delusions of grandeur of them "turning into £1m" for no reason out of some wildly over-inflated sense of entitlement & and extreme mental confusion...

    3. On page 8, "The real exchange rate has been appreciating over the past three years and remains broadly in line with fundamentals" refers to Iraq's genuine tiny "RV" movements like 1170:1 to 1166:1. The bit in bold refers to what you laughably and delusionally claim "doesn't exist" which is the need to back its fixed currency peg with CBI reserves. They're referring to what was explained above : $80bn CBI reserves / 84,000bn Dinar = "the fundamentals". On same page, they're also talking about Iraq's budget deficit and running out of money forcing "off books" spending.

    4. On page 10, "As a result, the spread between the official rate and the parallel market rate—which had been up to that point below 2% —started to climb, giving rise to a multiple currency practice, and reached over 8% in April 2013." They're talking about how the street / market value of the Dinar FELL to 8% below 1164:1 nearer 1257:1 market valued rate. Even today in Dec 2013 it's between 1210:1-1230:1. That means the exact opposite of being "undervalued". In same paragraph they're talking about how they're getting worried about the number of Iraqi's using foreign currency due to the fact the market value of the Dinar is +5% lower than its official peg!

    5. Page 6-7 talks about weak businesses, high unemployment and widespread poverty and Iraq's 131st place in UN's HDI and more deaths than the past 3 years. Page 9 talks about Iraq's 13% budget deficit next year. Page 11 talks about slowdowns in oil exports to emerging markets, Iraq's deteriorating security. Pages 14-15 describes the DFI as the only thing propping up fiscal buffers, food subsidies, and how Iraq would run out of money to pay Iraqi's salaries & pensions & for imported products after 6 months if oil prices fell.

    Continued...

    ReplyDelete
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    1. ...Continued

      6. The paragraph you quoted (p.17 paragraph 14) clearly states "The authorities agreed that a stable nominal exchange rate provides a valuable anchor for inflation expectations in an uncertain environment, and intend to continue implementing this policy for the foreseeable future." So the paragraph you quoted as "proof of the RV" actually turns out to say Iraq will continue to maintain a peg with a stable rate that doesn't move very much for at least the next 5 years and beyond - the exact opposite of your ridiculous "imminent RV" claim...

      7. The next paragraph 17 states : "On balance, in light of the need to preserve the independence of the CBI and maintain a high level of liquid reserves to address possible pressures on the Iraqi dinar..." are talking about the need to maintain high CBI Forex reserves to back Iraq's M2 money supply - which destroys your earlier claim when you made a complete fool of yourself claiming "There is no relationship between money supply and currency values". Even your own IMF sources say the exact opposite of what you "believe" and posted on DinarVets.

      8. Page 20, paragraph 21 predicts a RISE in unemployment. Paragraph 23 talks about how Iraq ranks 165th out of 183 for ease of doing business. Page 23, paragraph 31, reiterates Iraq are going to continue their current peg. Paragraph 32 reiterates Iraq aren't going to use their DFI reserves to back the Dinar, but rather to use as a budgetary buffer in case oil prices fall.

      9. Table 9 on page 25 shows that "growth in reserve money" and "growth in broad money" are actually the same from now until +2018 which proves beyond all shadow of a doubt there will be no massive increase in the Dinar's value. They'll print roughly 9-11% more money each year and increase CBI reserves to back that by 9-11% more each year. The ratio between them vs the $ stays the same. It also shows even in 2018 with all that extra oil being sold, Iraq's GDP per capita will be only $9.3k (about the same as Namibia or Peru).

      10. On page 32, paragraph 5, it talks about CBI reserves being adequate to back the Dinar's value at 104% at 1164:1, and that the slight 4% surplus that could increase the Dinar's value by 4% will instead be held in reserve in case oil prices fall : "The extra buffer is appropriate in light of the exceptional political and security risks in the country and in the region and the dependence on a single source of balance of payments revenues. The staff’s alternative scenario, simulating a 15% drop in oil prices below the baseline in 2013, shows that CBI reserves would be adequate to absorb a shock of this magnitude. CBI reserves would remain at 2013 levels through end-2015, after which reserve accumulation would resume at broadly the same pace as in the baseline scenario." That isn't "proof" of an increase in value, it's proof of the exact opposite!

      ...Continued

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    2. Continued...

      11. Page 33, paragraph 6 states : "A regional cross-country comparison shows that the current level of reserves as a percentage of GDP is comparable to its closest peers". Or in other words, Iraq's currency value IS its fair market value at below 1100:1 given the size of its reserves & economy vs others peer countries.

      12. Page 33, paragraph 7 states : "The weighted real effective exchange rate is therefore likely to be closer to the rate based on the official exchange rate than that based on the parallel market exchange rate." Read that carefully - Iraq believes 1210:1 unofficial market rate is "unfairly undervalued by 7-10%" but 1164:1 is more "fairly valued" for the Dinar. Only delusional scammers are talking about "rates" of $3.5, and stupid 100,000% appreciations, etc.

      13. Page 34, paragraph 8 states : "The external sustainability approach confirms the broad alignment of the exchange rate with fundamentals. " (ie, the Dinar is at the rate it should be given Iraq's money supply & reserves). "Therefore, the estimated undervaluation of the real exchange rate is close to 10 percent. Given the large margins of errors, these calculations suggest that the real exchange rate is in line with economic
      fundamentals"
      .
      , ie, Iraq believes their exchange rate is +10% more than the 1230:1 market value, which is still a rate well below 1100:1 and very close to their 1164:1.

      14. Page 34, paragraph 9 states : "On the other hand, the current spread between the official and parallel exchange rates may be suggestive of underlying fragilities that could warrant a real depreciation of the official rate." This is simple enough to be self-explanatory.

      15. Page 35 warns there's a "high risk" of the CBI independence being undermined by Iraqi politics which could lead to Iraq's FX reserves being seized & squandered on general govt spending (which would lead to a FALL in the Dinar's rate). It also warns there's a high risk of a fall in oil production due to the soaring violence which would lead to both a fall in the Dinar's value and an increase in Iraq's budget deficit.

      And the last few pages simply reiterate twice more Iraq's policy for a "stable exchange rate" will continue.

      ----------

      Only the most delusional pumper thinks all that means a "super RV windfall" is just around the corner, when it clearly and repeatedly states the exact opposite - that the Dinar is fairly valued at under 1100:1, that they have no intention of appreicating it over the next few years beyond a couple of percent and that their intention is a stable exchange rate which doesn't move much at all...

      All that from your OWN link you tried to "debunk the lopsters" with... All you've done is the same thing every other scammer does - run round downloading IMF reports, completely misunderstand what it says, then "put words into their mouth" trying to twist everything around to mean the exact opposite of what it does...

      Delete
    3. Forgot:-

      16. : On page 25, even the most optimistic oil peak at 4.75m barrels oil exports by 2018 (up from 2.7m in 2013). Assuming they actually meet their target (they didn't in 2013), given $100 oil prices, this means Iraq's "annual income" increases from $99bn to $173bn. Again, how is a $173bn income going to "support" a stupid $100,000-$275,000bn "RV"? It isn't - not even over 500 YEARS worth of oil exports will it even hit the lower figure. Make that 1,000x years just for the lower "$1 rate" figure since there isn't even $173bn surplus "available to back the currency" given that a very large chunk of that gets spent on Iraqi welfare & internal security.

      Delete
    4. " All you've done is the same thing every other scammer does - run round downloading IMF reports, completely misunderstand what it says, then "put words into their mouth" trying to twist everything around to mean the exact opposite of what it does..."


      Even then he has to cherry pick only the parts that somewhat fit his needs and completely ignore the parts that are clearly contradicting what he wants it to mean! He's doing the same thing over at DV, he has taken snippets of the same thing he has posted here and twisted it to mean something entirely different than what it actually says, typical Dinar Dreamer/pumper tactic. The difference is that over there no one refutes his nonsense or at least on the main part of the site where the hopelessly delusional hang out, the economic wizardry over at DV is truly awesome (and always good for a laugh LOL)!

      Delete
  25. http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=N6F6dePPUzI&autoplay=1&desktop_uri=%252Fwatch%253Fv%253DN6F6dePPUzI%2526autoplay%253D1

    Hillary Clinton reckons Iraq has one of the most educated people in the region. I am not stirring the pot but I want to know why some of your members do not think many Iraqis are educated

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    1. Only about 55,000 out of 30m Iraqi's have high level specialist oil industry related occupations. Much "employment" as your own IMF link stated, is welfare trying to hide unemployment figures:-

      "The oil sector employs only an estimated 80,000 workers out of a total of about 8 million in the labor force. Job security and a generous pay structure in the public sector set a high reservation wage and crowd out private employment. As a result, total job creation has been weak, averaging around 1 percent a year. Female participation in the labor force, at only 13 percent, is particularly low compared to international and regional standards. Aggregate labor market indicators also mask large geographical disparity, with official unemployment in some provinces at 20 percent. Public salaries are in many cases effectively transfers as many employees do not actually work.

      Do you honestly believe Iraq under Saddam was an educational beacon of paradise? Your own IMF report openly talked about Iraq's worries of a "brain drain" due to all the educated Iraqi's emigrating and not returning resulting in a primarily unskilled labour force. And Hillary Clinton (a neocon) reckons a lot of things about Iraq that aren't true (including the "30,000 tons of WMD's that could be readied and fired in 45mins", etc). She's full of the same BS as most political neocons are Republican & Democrat alike, (and even they aren't pumping the "RV").

      Delete
  26. Also everyone's thoughts on rear admiral David Nash. A man who has been involved in setting up business in Iraq and someone who spoke positively about the dinar. You would have thought someone who is esteemed to be a rear admiral would have nothing to do with a scam. Here is the you tube video
    http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=N6F6dePPUzI&autoplay=1&desktop_uri=%252Fwatch%253Fv%253DN6F6dePPUzI%2526autoplay%253D1

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    1. David Nash spoke positively about using the Dinar to invest in Iraq (and that way back in 2003 when the same people were laughably talking about "Iraq being fixed with just $50bn and the insurgency ending after 6 months"), not stuffing £500 worth of Dinar in your sock drawer and running round the Internet telling everyone "I'm gonna be a millionaire - any day now!".

      This is exactly the same mistake made over and over again by almost 3/4 of the RV community - you confuse articles, posts, video's, etc, about "rebuilding Iraq's economy" as "proof of a mythical mega-RV" which simply doesn't exist (and isn't mentioned anywhere in proclaimed videos, articles, etc). And you repeatedly ignore every main reason why the Dinar *isn't* at a higher rate in the first place - plain ordinary devaluation through inflating the money supply.

      Iraq used to be worth a lot more vs the $ back when they had a similar money supply to Kuwait's of today (20bn IQD). Since then they expanded their money supply over 4,000x fold (20bn -> 84,000bn) and guess what? The Dinar's value plummeted. It's now under 4,000x vs the KWD. It's really not that difficult to figure out what happened to Iraq once you stop pretending the Dinar "fell for no reason" or that inflation in Iraq "never happened".

      Delete
  27. If rear admiral David Nash is endorsing a scam then I think you guys will agree - he has contributed to the biggest scam the world has seen and should be stripped of his title and honour. His name is linked to dinar inc

    ReplyDelete
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    1. First of all your link is to Hillary babbling on with "Isn't the war going well, so vote for me!" PR BS from several years ago. Secondly, a quick Google of Admiral David Nash comes up with "beacons of wisdom" like : "It will take $55 billion to rebuild the infrastructure of Iraq" - Admiral David Nash. Which pretty much sums everything up about him. Over 1 TRILLION dollars and 10 years later, Iraq is still struggling with basic electricity in many areas. The massive unresolved corruption scandal was also on his "watch" (missing billions, Halliburton corruption, etc):-
      http://www.boston.com/business/globe/articles/2003/12/30/pentagon_freezes_iraq_funds_amid_corruption_probes/

      All you're doing yet again is running away from any debate on points YOU brought up in the first place, and are now just frantically picking random Youtube vids that have absolutely nothing to do with the "RV" scam as a diversion tactic. Will Iraq rebuild? In the long run, yes. Will their economy grow? Again, in the long run yes. But that won't send the Dinar soaring for reasons already explained : Iraq could boost their economy 8x and they'll just be in exactly the same position as South Korea with a currency still stuck under 1100:1 for one simple reason : They've printed too much money (84 TRILLION IQD vs 30 BILLION Kuwaiti Dinar), and until they lop they will continue to have too much money no matter what their economy does or who says what on Youtube because lopping is the only thing that reduces Iraq's money supply - "RV's" do not. Yes, Dinarbeliever, it really is that simple.

      Take a look at Iranian Rial. Why do you think its that weak despite selling all that oil? Why do you think all these currencies Iran, Indonesia, Vietnam, Zimbabwe, etc, with money supplies in the QUADRILLIONS all have FX rates <10000:1? Why is South Korea's rate only 1053:1 despite an 8.3x larger economy than Iraq's and a fully developed infrastructure? Why is Japan's under 100:1 despite a $5tn economy that's twice the size of the UK's which has a 168x stronger currency?

      The answer is pretty obvious. And deep down you already know why as it has been explained to you many times, you just don't want to admit it to "keep the dream alive".

      And this is why you're getting bashed so much. You run around yelling "kiss my ass, W*nkers" telling people you're going to "whoop them real good", then the second time running, you're taken so far out of your depth so quickly, all you can do is claim to be the victim of "name-calling". Are you serious?!?

      I have nothing against you personally, but its very obvious you don't understand a single thing about how currencies work in the real world. That's not a personal insult, just an observation. But I also don't understand a thing about motorbikes, yet I wouldn't dream of spamming off articles on motorcycle forums talking about how motorbikes have 5% reserved engine power for increased torque and telling people "it's proof that a 200mph Yahama can do 200,000-600,000mph!" and that everyone who says a 200mph motorbike can do only 200mph is just "too stupid to see the secret". And yet that's the exact perfect analogy as to what people who post articles on "proof of the 100,000% RV" (which are nothing of the kind) are doing...

      Delete
    2. Lol, great analogy!!! DB you know you have no clue what you're talking about. Brian simpson and dwm009 clearly do know what they're saying and yet you continue to ignore questions and facts. Keepmwlknfny already exposed your nonsense months ago but you just committed suicide by trying to run that regurgitated nonsense over here. Ouch, this is entertaining.

      Delete
  28. Here is a research paper on tying IQD to oil. Honest thoughts on how possible this would be
    http://www.hks.harvard.edu/fs/jfrankel/What_to_do_with_Iraqs_Currency.pdf

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. If you read this DB, it is a paper proposing that Iraq (and other small single resource exporters) adopt a hybrid currency policy where their currency is partially pegged to the price of their export, so oil for Iraq. This has some advantages in that it keeps the flow of dinars more stable even if oil fluctuations but It does not address the difficulty for importers with constantly changing exchange rates.This does nothing along the lines of the goofy claims that oil in the ground can be used to back a currency. In no way does it support the idea that a huge RV is possible, or would be even if Iraq had adopted this proposal, which clearly they did not (the paper is from fall 2003). So with regard to the mythical RV, this is irrelevant.

      Delete
  29. And please stop personal insults or look like you laughing at me. I am being respectful and I am not trolling this site on dinar vets. I expect the same level of respect please. I am here to learn off you guys and I want you to debunk the stuff I post but I don't want laughing or ridiculing.

    ReplyDelete
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    1. DB honestly TAKE A GOOD LOOK AT YOURSELF!!!! What would you think of someone who has acted the way you have, you try to act sincere over here, sometimes anyway, and then you go over to DV and post more non-sense and try to pretend to be an expert on subjects you clearly know nothing about -as evidenced by what you have to say on these same subjects here on this site. You are asking for respect but respect must be earned and you will never earn respect here or at DV the way you have been acting, some over at DV may pretend to side with you either because of desperation in wanting to believe what you are saying or maybe some will just to try to counter what has been said here because of dislike for what this site is trying to do. Either way you have shown that beyond a shadow of a doubt that you are totally clueless about economics and no amount of copy/pasting of articles that you clearly do not understand is going earn you any respect what-so-ever!


      You want respect? Then stop the non-sense with the futile attempt to present yourself as knowledgeable by using copy/pasting of things you don't understand and then try, in your own words, to answer a few of the very simple and legitimate questions that have been asked of you. Whenever confronted with even the simplest question you simply dodge the issue and take off in another direction, you have yet to make a single point that was not quickly debunked by easily verifiable information and then you again simply take off in another direction!


      You say you are here to learn???? Well you damn sure have a strange way of trying to learn! That's twice you have said that but then you ran right back to DV after the first time you asked "to learn" about something and laughably tried to portray yourself as an expert on the very subject you asked about. The really funny part is that even the delusional at DV saw it for what it was so if you want people to stop laughing at you then you will first have to stop making yourself look like a clown!

      Delete
    2. Oh please! You're not here to learn...you've already proved that the last exchsnge around. You completely ignored the facts and evidence and ran right over to DV to mock this site and pound on your chest. You're a joke just like the average member in DV. Who gives 2 Shiites what a guy said in a YouTube video. You're clueless and need serious help. You've been provided with thorough proof and evidence on how silly this all is. You have zero understanding on anything you post and cherry pick. You can get away with that nonsense on DV with all the other idiots but over here you are just embarrassing yourself. But you're not the first to do so and you won't be the last. Give it up already, you're lost and a phony.

      Delete
  30. Here goes dontlop again with this gem. He's been farting this out of his mouth for months.

    How could the Kuwait dinar be selling for its market rate of 5 cents all of the sudden be selling for over 3 dollars because of a decree of the the govt of Kuwait to honor that rate which they did not honor for over a year not be called a revaluation


    And don't tell me the official exchange rate didn't change be cause it did it went down for its new value after the war

    Besides if the official rate is all that matters than the Iraqi Swiss dinar was demonetized in 1990 so its official rate was
    Zero which means it was revalued to over 5 cents each from zero

    That was in 2003 it was exchanged at 150 Swiss dinar for one new Iraq dinar
    And it's official exchange rate was zero the day before

    ReplyDelete
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    1. This comment has been removed by the author.

      Delete
    2. He added this at the end:

      The Kuwait dinar was revalued like it or not

      So was the Swiss Iraqi dinar

      So go take a nap

      The Kuwait govt did not honor their currency at its official exchange rate so it had no official exchange rate those who held the Kuwait dinar were broke during the invasion

      The Iraqi government did honor the exchange rate of zero for the Swiss Iraqi dinar for 13 years

      Zero get it

      It was revalued to over 5 cents each from zero

      It was revalued in 2003 by the coalition authority and implemented by the cbi in October 2003 thru January 2004
      Edited by dontlop, Today, 10:42 AM.

      Delete
    3. Sam did a whole article debunking this imaginary "Kuwaiti RV" nonsense here:-
      http://dinardouchebags.blogspot.co.uk/2013/11/an-international-economist.html

      The KWD did not fluctuate internationally in value by more than about 4% from Series 3 notes in pre-war 1980's to Series 5 notes in 1995 all through out 1990-1991. There was no Kuwaiti "RV". It's a total pumper fabrication (for the benefit of "DinarBeliever" & "dontlop").

      Delete
    4. Dontlop at DV does come across as pretty desperate. He really seems to get upset over any argument that an RV is not possible, so perhaps he has invested far more than he can afford to lose. But who knows, maybe thats just my interpretation.

      In any case the interesting thing is the faulty logic being employed. Dontlop constantly pushes the refrain CallingFO mentions, that Kuwait RVed the KWD and the CBI RV'ed the Swiss dinar so they can do a huge RV with the IQD. If the space shuttle is a vehicle and my VW is a vehicle, I should be able to drive to orbit!!! Having some context where two things can be labeled the same does not make them the same.

      A currency can make huge swings in value, no question about that (e.g Bitcoins), and even pegged currencies can be artificially depressed and then rebound (the Irainian Rial dropped about 50% this past summer). Maybe the KWD did drop to 1/100th its value on the street during the war So if you were in Kuwait and had 10 or 20K of USD on you, maybe you could have made a couple million. If indeed it did happen, does this inform us about the possibility of an IQD RV? Of course not since the KWD at no time went above the money supply / reserves limit. Is the IQD artificially being held way below this limit for Iraq? No, Iraq got to its present low value the old fashioned way, by hyperinflation, and its reserves, exchange rate and money supply are all in sync.

      The Swiss dinar was indeed valued at 150 IQD during the Bremmer exchange. But does calling this an RV inform us about the IQD? Again alas no as 150 IQD was the value of the Swiss Dinar, it was just redenominated where no one made any money. For dontlop the fact that the CBI did not accept Swiss Dinar after Saddam issued new currency (that he could print) is the same as having an exchange rate of 0. So the Bremmer exchanged was an infinitely large RV!!! 150 to 0!! Anything is possible!!! Well no of course not. Since you could not walk into a bank during this time with 0 dollars and walk out with as many Swiss Dinar as you like, clearly not accepting a currency is not the same as a 0 rate. But even if it was, at no time does the CBI exceed the money supply / reserves limit for IQD, or Swiss Dinar.

      But none of that sinks in for dontlop, who only wants to find some currency event he can brand an RV so as to be able to say "RVs have occurred so the IQD can be RVed by some huge margin as well". I'd hate to think he really doesn't understand the fallacy here, but who knows.

      Delete
    5. The Kuwait thing.... When Saddam invaded the central bank shut down along with every bank in the country. So during this time that dinarians claim the exchange rate went down (it never did, only the street rate dropped like has been stated a number of times) during this time the Central Bank and all other banks were shut down and didn't open until Saddam had be kicked out of the country. So not one single Kuwaiti dinar was issued by the Central Bank, or sold by any other bank, at a rate less than the official $3 something exchange rate.
      Again, because this is important. the Kuwait central bank did not issue 1 single dinar for less than their official $3 rate.
      The Iraq central bank has been issuing dinar for 10 years now for $.00086 or worse. They have issued 80 TRILLION of them at that rate.
      Anyone who thinks those situations are even remotely similar has a screw loose.

      Delete
  31. I understand that Kuwait never revalued their currency. Iraq is in a different situation entirely and it can't be compared to Kuwait. I am not going to run over to dinar vets to spill stuff about the dinar anymore. But I want to hang with you guys because I am starting to realise a number of things.
    Marcus Curtis has done a lot of research but he is wrong when he states Iraq won't have an international tradeable currency. I posted an article about the IMF on here and dinar vets- I did not ridicule this site I was pointing out that Iraq does want to go international with their currency.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Yes, that's right Dinarbeliever, Iraq IS different - because Kuwait expanded their money supply from 20bn IQD to 30bn KWD, whilst Iraq expanded theirs from 20bn IQD to 84,000bn IQD (4,200x fold)... It's called "Chronic Inflation", and Iraq is no different to the other 40-odd countries to suffer from it. Iraq is in fact, far more closer to the Lebanese Pound than Kuwait. And that isn't "undervalued" either simply because it happens to have 3 zeros on the end.

      And any currency can become "internationally tradable" but that doesn't mean a thing as far as its value is concerned. As explained to you earlier - go into any UK bank or Bureau de Change and you'll see only about 70-80 currencies listed out of the +180 countries worldwide to buy banknotes from, not because the "missing" ones are "undervalued" or some "secret plan" but simply because no-one wants to visit war-torn countries like Somalia, Yemen, Libya, Iraq, etc, for holiday vacations where thousands are dying from bomb blasts, kidnappings, etc, each year...

      Delete
    2. NB: Sorry, typo. Should have read : "Kuwait expanded their money supply from 20bn KWD to 30bn KWD, whilst Iraq expanded theirs from 20bn IQD to 84,000bn IQD (4,200x fold)"

      Delete
    3. What do you think "internationally tradable" means DB? Do you own IQD? Are you an Iraqi citizen?

      Do you still the think the IQD is "severely undervalued"? If so please explain why.

      Delete
    4. DB: "I am not going to run over to dinar vets to spill stuff about the dinar anymore. "

      really? What did you just post there?

      Posted Today, 01:16 PM
      Dr Bakri also stated that a 1000 dinar note would buy 1 packet of cigarettes then after the currency reform that same 1000 dinar note would now buy 1000 cigarettes. He is not talking about a typical redonomination

      Delete
  32. I am concerned that companies like dinar trade can get away will selling a scam. What are your guys views on the dinar dealers. How do they get away with promoting an investment which according to everyone here is not possible. If it's not possible they should be stopped

    ReplyDelete
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    1. They do so because they "split" the pumping off from the dealers so as not to fall foul of investment regulations:-

      Eg, the dealer sites will have have disclaimers like:-

      "D Trade Inc. is not an investment company. No information on this site should be construed as investment advice." - Dinar Trade

      "We are not investment advisers, financial consultants, or in any way authorized or licensed to provide you with councel. We specialize in the buying and selling of foreign currencies only. Please do your own research, review your current financial situation, and purchase with prudence and care. Purchasing foreign currencies is always a risk, especially those of third world countries, and you should be aware that you are doing so at your own risk." - Treasury Vault

      "Dinar UK can not guarantee any specific return. As with any purchase of currency there is always a risk that the value can go down." (Dinar UK)

      Every single time it's the same - : Our pumper affiliates "suggest" it "might" shoot up 1,000-3,500x in value (to justify outrageous 20-80% buy/sell premium's) but we will never say that outright or make up dates & rates on our actual sales site.

      Some of them who mixed the two have indeed been shut down. Others fined. In fact Dinar Trade were fined & shut down for a year. That was the year "Ali" claimed he "voluntarily" took a year's break and Dinar Trade stopped buying & selling Dinar for a while. In reality, here's the original court order slapping a "Cease & Desist" order on them by the Arkansas Securities Dept:-

      "By agreement and with the consent of the Staff and the authorized representative of Dinar Trade, it is hereby ordered that Dinar Trade shall be responsible for the payment of a civil penalty in the amount of $20,000.00 to the Arkansas Securities Department. The violations by Dinar Trade support an assessment by the Commissioner of a civil penalty against pursuant to Ark. Code Ann. 2365-805.."
      http://www.securities.arkansas.gov/!userfiles/Orders/2011/Consent%20Order%20C-11-0205-11-OR02.pdf

      You can even see "Ali's" signature on the bottom signed & dated 4/5/2011.

      Meanwhile the pumper sites do the reverse and make up all sorts of fake sh*t, yet try and hide the fact they get a "kickback" from the sales site for referrals, web advertising & fake "premium services". Like Dinar Alert which claims to have "high level sources that will be the first to break" but in reality is nothing more than a Javascript program watching xe.com

      Meanwhile, pumper sites have universal disclaimers like:-

      - "WARNING! This site is for entertainment purposes only" - Breitling's Blog

      - "DO NOT USE THE OPINIONS EXPRESSED WITHIN THOSE SECTIONS AS REASONS TO GO OUT AND INVEST. PLEASE BE AWARE THAT INVESTING IN IRAQI DINAR, IN ANY FOREIGN CURRENCY IS RISKY, AND COULD RESULT IN FINANCIAL LOSS." - Dinar Daddy

      - "All information posted on the Site is purely for entertainment and should not be relied upon for any purpose." - Planet Dinar (Blaino)

      - "None of the content on the Site shall be construed as legal, investment, accounting or any other type of advice or recommendations or endorsements of any investment. All information posted on the Site is purely for entertainment value and should not be relied upon for any purpose. - Dinar Vets

      - "This site is merely for informational/entertainment purposes" - Dinar Recaps

      etc, etc. Much of this is to protect themselves from lawsuits by people who said "You told me it would go up 1,000x", etc.

      Delete
    2. Because in the fine print they say that they are not investment advisors (let alone fiduciaries) and are making no assurances about what might happen to the rate of the IQD etc etc. That may (or may not) protect them in the end from criminal action, but I think its unlikely to protect them from possible civil actions once enough people lose money. But the fact that people don't like to admit they have been conned helps the dealers out. I think its also likely that very few of the rich and powerful fell for this so its just the throngs of smaller investors the dealers have to deal with. Its no different than getting spam mail about some penny stock "poised for explosive growth" with analogous find print. It isn't illegal to be a scumbag.

      Delete
    3. It's also why they all hide behind anonymous avatars or use fake names. Dinar Vets is run by "Adam Montana", but that's not his real name.

      Delete
    4. Also, to piggy back off of Brian Simpson's posting of Dinar Trade in Arkansas, so was Dinar Banker / Sterling Currency Group fined by court order for the same exact thing.

      http://www.securities.arkansas.gov/!userfiles/C-11-0208-11-OR01.pdf

      Now here's the kicker, the courts are looking for outright blatant infraction of the law which is what they justice system is bound by which means that these gurus/pumpers/dealers toe the line and rightfully so put the owness completely on the "speculator". That being said, it is your money, your decision, your job to do due diligence as in any other risky proposal. So if it wasn't clear to you before why these gurus say this is NOT an investment it is because they want to shy away as far as possible from being linked to a possible court indictment. To be further clear for DINARBELIEVER you can no longer claim you don't know this is a well devised scheme with many chief cooks and bottle washers.


      Also from Brian's post above which I include here about Blaino is evidence these gurus are just out for entertainment so that is what you are paying for when you buy the dinar. They get their cut and so do the Money Service Business (a.k.a. dinar dealers). If you want to continue to be entertained by their vile trash go right ahead. Just remember one thing. The law is not going to protect nor assist you with recovering any financial losses when the lop occurs, the rate doesn't increase like you believe it will, your notes become useless because banks won't buy them as they do not now AND dinar dealers give you the option of raping you further by charging you a substantial fee to swap notes or are forced to pay for a pricey round trip ticket to Iraq that the increase you've made thus fair will barely pay for the fare. Worst case scenario is you end up with a bunch of Iraqi memorabilia. LOL!!!

      - "All information posted on the Site is purely for entertainment and should not be relied upon for any purpose." - Planet Dinar (Blaino)

      Delete
  33. I don’t think DB asked this question sincerely. I think he’s thinking this is a question that proves it’s not a scam.
    Doubt he was expecting real answers and examples of dinar dealers actually getting in trouble.
    Dinar Daddy used to make post talking about the RV all the time on his site. As soon as he and his wife bought currency vault (apparently business is in her name) he stopped making claims.
    Remember when those clowns got indicted. That’s about the time that Ali pissed off a lot of people when he went on a conference call and stated that anyone who thought there would be a large RV was on drugs.
    At the same time Roger (Dinar Daddy) after years and years of claiming a lop would never happen, Roger made a post on his site where he said it had become obvious that a lop was what was going to happen in Iraq and there was no big RV.
    Those guys got the crap scared out of them by those indictments and they covered their arse.
    I still don’t understand how Dinar Daddy gets away with what he does. Even though he makes no statements, his sight has every crazy rumor and prediction posted, all the while him and his wife sell dinar. That has to be cutting a very fine line of legality.

    ReplyDelete
  34. Thanks guys the dealers seem to be treading a fine line.

    ReplyDelete
  35. How do I contact Sam I am privately

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Gee I wonder why suddenly you want to communicate with Sam I Am 'PRIVATELY'!!! Could it be that you have run out BS lines, your sham game has crumbled so fast, the folk here are beyond your capacity, the name calling is keeping you up at night, or you need a shoulder to cry on??? This is a forum AND A REAL ONE at that!! Where everyone posts opinions, facts, etc and if you act out you get hammered but if you are respectable towards others a REAL debate can exist.

      I sure hope that Sam is at his wits end with you and cuts you off here soon because this site was not designed for idiots who think they are going to infiltrate it with their pathetic agenda of expanding GURUMORISM.

      Look,,, I would not be surprised if you are James Wolf "Adam Montana" other altered ego. You guru's / pumpers / multi-level marketing meatheads always have a trademark that you can't seem to hide which is essentially the game you've brought to this table.

      Delete
    2. The reason why I want to contact Sam I am privately is I have some concerns over a dinar dealer that I don't want broadcasting but want to bring to his attention

      Delete
  36. DB you're a class act that's for sure! You are doing nothing but putting on an act here and you are still up to doing your same old tricks over at DV, you come here and ask us give you respect and not to laugh at you but then you of all people have the gall to post THIS on DV?????????

    "DB Says,
    "Fib by posting the chart and avoiding a simple question is showing holes. What's the answer market rate or official rate. I want to know which one matters more"

    You then in several more posts pressed for an answer to your question??? YOU who have repeatedly avoided simple questions aimed at you? Of course you can't answer these simple questions because you simply don't know!


    BTW, asking Fib not to post anymore of what you say over here (like you did!) is not going to help much, you are quite apparently very embarrassed at your feeble attempts and don't want your buddies to see what you're really like and how little you really know but guess what? This is the INTERNET!!!! This site is just a click away and don't think for a minute none of your buddies, especially that idiot Dontlop (sorry Sam I can't help it in this case!) don't see any of this just because it doesn't get posted over there! What are you afraid of anyway? Why should you be ashamed for those guys to see you here if you know so much? Give it up guy THEY DO SEE YOU for what you are and nothing you can do now is going to fix that. You have shown the world how little you know and posting copy/paste clips is not going to save your image now, they have seen you here and they already know so you can't change that now!

    ReplyDelete
  37. Well it looks like Dontlop is getting paid overtime to pump as much hype as possible as a form of damage control after the recent shellacking that DB has taken over here.

    Back when I was on DV I absolutely schooled Dontlop when he was attempting pump the Swiss Dinar RV lie as well as the Kuwait RV lie. I was banned right after that. Dontlop whined and cried after I punked him out about how some "lobsters" should be banned if they don't believe in this "investment". Looks like he got his wish. Shocking huh?

    Even though dinarbeliever was foolish.......I mean brave enough to come over here, something tells me Dontlop never will. For one he knows he would be exposed for the hype pumper that he is. For two he is just simply gutless and cant even begin to attempt debate without Adam to help ban his opposition. Dontlop is the perfect example of a classic pumper. He knows exactly how to create illusion by spreading lies about events that never happened. He knows good and well that there was never a RV in Kuwait or with the Swiss Dinar but that isn't what matters. His agenda to create the illusion that there was one so that his bosses can continue to sell dinar. Its perfectly obvious what he is doing yet the poor sheep at DV are too blind to see it.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. It's very evident what dontlop agenda is is also known who he actually his as well. When I was on DV and dontlop first made his appearance I called him out. His posts were identical to sonny1..after that he had to change how he posted. He's not fooling anyone. Just like when sonny posted something under his other screen name (professor) thinking he was signed in as sonny then quickly made up some garbage excuse that someone at work was signed in and he didn't realize it. Then poof the post was gone lol. He's a joke and always has been. Nothing but a paid hype man/ damage control.

      Delete
  38. DB, I have a simple challenge for you, just a simple question. You were persistent in trying to get an answer over at DV but you yourself have only avoided questions here by ducking the issue yet you expect others to respond to a question when you ask. Now here is a chance for you to show us that you know at least something, come on now I CHALLENGE you to answer, in your own words,

    "Why do you think the Dinar is undervalued"?

    Simple enough, now no dodging or changing the subject if you know anything at all about this so called "investment", ANYTHING, you should be able to answer that simple challenge! Come on now here's your chance, your DV buddies will be watching just as will we so the ball is in your court and I'll be waiting.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. dwm,,,, I'd LOVE to see an answer or even a whimper out of him because that is precisely what pumpers do. Answer questions with irrelevant questions creating a distraction hoping you've forgotten the whirlpool of lies so they can kick on the windtunnel and suck you in. They escape for a time frame and return like a dog with the tali between the legs licking you. Except I have much more respect for a dog because they listen and are loyal friends.

      Delete
    2. I have answered your question see at the bottom

      Delete
  39. Dinarbeliever stated, "I am concerned that companies like dinar trade can get away will selling a scam." How is DinarTrade or any other dealer / pumper different from the game you have been playing here at this site and DV?? They are just as dishonest as you are by you stating you're interest in learning, perpetrating an economic skilled individual or mathematician at best, etc. Many of these guys here though not financial or economic professionals certainly present an extremely powerful argument with overwhelmingly relevant evidence that is exceeds what even some professionals out there would be willing to share.

    I say all of that because while others who may be silently idle following this and past threads are soaking this stuff up like a sponge for self edification as well as helping other who TRULY want the truth. You are an absolute waste of time because just as you fail to answer any of the simple questions others and myself have presented you with when you were the COWBOY toughguy pretending to display an image that you clearly are not.

    NOW,,, it's time to either put up or shut up!!!!! There is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING impressive, entertaining nor interesting about you and my heart goes out to those poor bozos that give you more than 30 seconds of ear time because my radar picked up your BS the minute you stepped in calling everyone on this site "wankers". Personally I believe you were staring at photos of yourself when you made claim. I and I'm sure others here would respect you more if you would admit at the very minimum that you are here to troll and waste their time as you EVIDENTLY have not intentions of learning ANYTHING you state you'd like to learn. You're a pumper, liar, sociopath (http://www.naturalnews.com/036112_sociopaths_cults_influence.html) and possibly bordering paranoid schizophrenia (but that's neither here nor there), paid troll, shill, and any other role that fits what the dinar community buffoons love to portray. I'm no psychologist or mental health professional but when the symptoms fit it's time you quit. Just as you should quit this little game of false facts concerning the so-called prominent "imminent RV". You and I both know you realized you're wrong, you DV pets know you've been exposed for lies so you're only other motive now is to play your little shenanigans on this site. If Sam eventually runs out of kindness and patience with you and blocks your post I can assure you that I and many others will not miss you. So my strong recommendation to you is either go back to DV and continue your buffoonery or just give up completely on the dinar community posting. That is if you can handle the withdrawal side effects!!! ;-)

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I am not a paid shill I wish I was though so I could go part time or leave work. I admit I am being provocative again like keepem and fib I get a kick out of it. Again I am pro RV and whilst I won't troll this site on dinar vets I will challenge the redonominators members at dinar vets. I've not got schizophrenia but I probably have a personality disorder pretty much like yourself.

      Delete
    2. Also if Sam I am censors me- isn't that as bad as what you guys claim Montana does?

      Delete
    3. vinnyg7 I would miss you if my posts were deleted and Sam I am does what you guys claim happens at dinar vets. Me and you could become very good friends one day.

      Delete
    4. Dinarbeliever - "Also if Sam I am censors me- isn't that as bad as what you guys claim Montana does?"

      No, because Montana censors people for telling the truth / posting actual facts rather than any genuine abuse. There have been hundreds of people banned at DinarVets purely for "daring" to post official CBI statements that openly debunk the RV and make the pumpers look fools. Like:-

      - The Iraqi currency change will not have any effect on the international value of the Iraqi dinar and economy"

      - "The change that will take place with the Iraqi currency will change the face value of the dinar and not the real value as measured by the value of Iraqi dinar against the dollar and gold"

      - "The exchange rate between the new banknotes and the old ones would be 1:1,000.", etc.

      Sam hasn't banned or censored anyone here. There's been no need to since every pumper who's turned up trying to shovel the get-rich-quick scam has universally had his a*s handed to him. Enorreste was utterly destroyed here in the summer. Someone copied & pasted the whole thread to Dinar Vets, and it was deleted and his account banned within minutes (out of sheer embarrassment). Your posting over the past week has been downright weird though when you compare what you've written here to some posts made on DV (within minutes) and the different tone & style of writing between the forums. At times, it's almost seems as if two completely different people are using your account, which raises suspicions to say the least...

      Delete
    5. Brian, There's definitely an up side to DB's posts however since it not only has exposed him to his buddies for what he really is it has also produced some serious discussion about the common myths that I am sure a lot of people from DV have now seen. For those who are sincere but simply mis-guided the trash that DB and others like him post over at DV may look logical and encouraging in that environment but when contrasted to the uncensored truth and common sense found here it suddenly looks like the nonsense that it most certainly is. We can be sure that folks over there have come here to see what the hubbub has been about and hopefully a lot of them will be exposed to the truth that has thus far been hidden from them. Sometimes these guys can be their own worst enemy as DB has clearly been and he has done something useful, maybe not what he set out to do but it most likely has done a lot of good by exposing some of the mis-guided to the real facts!

      Delete
    6. Agreed dwm0009. Anyone who runs any discussion forum knows for every poster, there's up to 10 "lurkers" who quietly read without posting. A lot of people have woken up to the scam this past year. Certainly the number of people who previously bought into it who are now reselling their Dinar on Ebay has shot up from a few years ago.

      Delete
  40. "..my heart goes out to those poor bozos that give you more than 30 seconds of ear time because my radar picked up your BS.."

    I just want to be clear because I didn't state it properly before, when I say "bozos" I'm not referring to this site but those at DV who follow DB.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. No one follows me at dinar vets I am not montana

      Delete
  41. Hi guys I think the Iraqi dinar is undervalued because of the resources Iraq possesses. Also because international economists and member of the Iraqi parliament are saying so.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. "the Iraqi dinar is undervalued because of the resources Iraq possesses."

      Nope. Venezuela has the highest proven oil reserves in the world. Why isn't their total amount of currency worth 10s or 100s of trillions of USD like you're saying Iraqs should be?

      "Also because international economists"

      Where?

      "member of the Iraqi parliament are saying so."

      Members of the Iraqi parliament talking about the rate are either talking about a lop or are talking about how the street rate (typically 1240 to 1300 to 1) is lagging behind the official rate.

      Even if they are saying it's undervalued, what makes you think they're saying it's 300,000% undervalued rather than 10%?

      It has been proven time and time again that the dinar is not undervalued. If you look at their GDP and their M2 and their reserves their currency is worth what it should be.

      When you look at those things, Iraqs currency is worth, relatively, the same as every other country on the planet. Your fantasy RV would have that currency worth thousands of times more than it should be. It'd be worth more than the rest of the currency on the planet put together.

      Go look at your list that Markinsa gave you:

      http://dinarvets.com/forums/index.php?/topic/167382-economic-representative-announces-deferral-of-removal-of-zeros-to-the-next-parliamentary-session/page-4

      Iraq is 61st, with 71 billion. That's where they belong, based on their reserves, their GDP, and the fact that Iraq is a third world toilet with a one sided economy.

      Now look at the top of the list. Your RV wouldn't just put them at #1, ahead of China with their 15 trillion. It'd give them almost TWENTY TIMES China's M2. Their currency would be worth more than EVERYONE ELSE ON THE LIST ADDED TOGETHER. Can you really not understand how insane that is? If you honestly can't, and actually think that's reasonable, there is no point in trying to talk sense to you. You're just wasting everyone's time. I'd suggest that at the very least, since you're not capable of understanding basic economics, you at least stop trying to convince other people because you could do them serious emotional and financial harm.

      Delete
    2. Hi guys I think the Iraqi dinar is undervalued because of the resources Iraq possesses. Also because international economists and member of the Iraqi parliament are saying so.


      Well I guess that's about all we could expect from you but at least it was an answer and done in a respectful manner so let's keep it that way, this is at least a start so let's discuss this.

      Now you say you believe it's not undervalued because of resources but that's just wishful thinking since Iraq's currency is clearly based on it's foreign reserves that currently stand at roughly $75+ billion. However if you want to disagree then how about you enlighten us as to just HOW Iraq is backing it's pegged currency with resources since it is known to the entire world outside Dinar forums that the Dinar is officially pegged to the Dollar. Also just who are these mysterious "International economists" and where/when did the Iraqi Parliament say the Dinar is severely undervalued except when discussing the STREET rate (which is of no concern to any mythical "RV")? I am willing to bet you can't produce even one respected "economist" that would even hint that the Iraqi Dinar is undervalued because it obviously is not except to those blinded by wishful thinking, that is unless these international economists are Kraporoni and others of his ilk! Iraqi Parliament often speaks of the low value of the Dinar when discussing the STREET RATE of the Dinar which has nothing at all to do with the official exchange rate as far as any mythical "RV" is concerned but since you like many Dinar Dreamers don't understand the difference between Market rate and the official exchange rate then it becomes easy to misunderstand what the Iraqi Parliament is talking about, add in the twisted mis-information from the Gurus and and another "forum fact" is born. I bet you can not find one single article, not ONE, of Iraqi Parliament discussing the official exchange rate of 1166 to one being "severely undervalued"! These articles are often pitched as "GREAT NEWS" on sites like DV but the delusional readers simply ignore the references to street rates or blackmarket prices or the mention of rates well in excess of 1200+ to the Dollar which clearly tells us they are not talking about the official exchange rate, the Dinar value being undervalued on the streets of Iraq simply tells us that even Joe Iraqi doesn't want the Dinar! Now find us even one article where Iraqi officials or any respected economists are saying the Dinar OFFICIAL exchange rate is undervalued, just ONE! I bet you can't do it.

      Delete
    3. Dinarbeliever - "Also because international economists and member of the Iraqi parliament are saying so."

      Actually, they're saying the exact opposite:-

      - "The exchange rate between the new banknotes and the old ones would be 1:1,000." - Mahma Khalil, Member of the Iraqi Parliament and official spokesperson of the Economic Committee

      "A report on Monday by the International Monetary Fund (IMF) suggests that the Iraqi dinar is currently fairly valued at 1170 dinars to the US dollar"
      http://www.iraq-businessnews.com/2011/03/30/imf-suggests-stable-iraqi-dinar/

      You have it right there in those sentences alone (of dozens) from the Iraqi Parliament & Economic Committee that they're going to redenominate (Lop) and the IMF agreeing that it's NOT undervalued. I simply do not understand this weird obsession with ignoring everything Iraq is actually saying (and has been consistently saying since 2008) and trying to "pretend away" all official statements made over the past 3 years. Some people in Iraq believe that Iraq's street value (1210:1-1250:1) is undervalued by 5-10% (as mentioned in your own IMF report yesterday) and that its fair market value is nearer 1100:1, but that's a wildly different thing to the "RV" being pumped.

      Delete
    4. DB, while you're at it, ask Markinsa why the chart he's spamming all over DV shows a change from 289.99 to 290.98 is a 100% change. Anyone with basic math skills should be able to figure out that that is a change of about 1/3 of 1%, yet he apparently thinks it's actually 100% rather than someone making a math error or a typo.

      Also ask your boy dontlop why he keeps saying that Kuwait didn't reinstate the value because it changed from 3.45 to 3.20 (a change of greater than 7%) when Markinsa chart clearly shows no change of greater than 1% during that time period. Of course his entire argument is just ignorant, but the fact that he's basing his ignorant argument on (a change of greater than 7%) isn't even true.

      Delete
  42. I see dontlop is back on his Kuwait and Swiss dinar quick, whining endlessly about it. Why don't you do something productive and ask him why he spends so much time ranting about those two things when it's obvious to even a third grader that neither bears any similarity to the current situation with the IQD?

    Did they print 25,000 dinar denominations in either of those currencies? Nope. Did what either of those currencies did create hundreds of billions or trillions of dollars in wealth? Nope. So why prattle on endlessly about them? What's his motive? 5,500 posts in the last year, why? What's he getting out of it?

    It's like the lopsters are asking him to show them a unicorn (an RV like what would happen to the IQD) and he's showing them a goat and a cow and claiming they're unicorns.

    ReplyDelete
  43. Dontlop (sonny1) is just doing his job which is creating RV illusion. What he is getting out of is paid. I am sure he is in with Dinar Banker or one of the other dealers. Its blatantly obvious what he is doing. Its funny how Dinarbeliever hangs on Dontlops every word........yeah lobsters.....which one matters.......market or official.....duh.......Good point Dontlop. All Dontlop needs is for the delusional wannabe "investors" to believe that the lies he creates maybe true. That's all it takes to sell dinar for his bosses.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Dontlop is not sonny1. But I do miss sonny1 input.

      Delete
    2. Yes dontlop is sonny1. Get over it. And yes you're an idiot and yes there will be no millionairs from the Iraqi dinar. You're delusion and clueless

      Delete
    3. Why would you miss his input? The guy is completely clueless. Sam had a whole thread dedicated to him showing how little he knows and all his failed RV predictions. Why do you think he stopped posting as sonny and had to switch to dontlop. The guy has been wrong 100% of the time and continues his nonsense of pumping for DV.

      Delete
  44. Yep. They prattle on endlessly about things like Kuwait because it works. Anyone with a brain knows there's no similarity between the situation in Kuwait and the situation in Iraq, so whether you call it an RV, or an RI, or a whangdoodle makes absolutely no difference. They lie and mislead and obfuscate in order to create doubt (or hope, depending on which way you look at it), and they do that because it sells dinar.

    They're garbage. Absolute garbage.

    DB, you don't understand economics, so you think that there's a chance the RV will happen. We do understand economics, so we KNOW for a FACT that it won't. That's the difference between you and us (assuming you're not just a lying paid shill).

    One of two things is going to happen.
    1. They'll eventually get their act together and lop.
    2. The rate will muddle around in the 900 to 1300 range for the next 20 years.

    Those are the only options. A massive RV can not and will not ever happen. There's no reason it would and no reason it could. So when your dreams of riches never materialize, are you going to be honest and admit you were scammed at that the people here were trying to help you, or are you going to believe that Adam and Sonny1 and all the rest of the liars and scammers were telling you the truth rather than taking advantage of your ignorance in order to make hundreds of thousands or millions of dollars off of advertising and worthless VIP/OSI/OGIT/LLCs/Trusts/etc?

    The "no one knows what's going to happen with the IQD" is just one more nugget of a BS out of a mountain of it spread around by these frauds. I don't know whether or not GOOG is going to go up to 1200 or down to 800 over the next year, but I GUARANTEE it will not go up to 3,000,000 a share. You wanna bet against me? Same thing with the IQD. Could go up a little, could go down a little, could lop, but WILL NOT EVER go up even 1,000%, let alone the 300,000% you're predicting. There's no millionaires to be made here (other than by fleecing sheep like you). You haven't bought a lottery ticket. You've bought a piece of toilet paper that conmen have told you is a lottery ticket, but there's never going to be a drawing and you have zero chance of winning big.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I beg to differ. I think when Iraq goes to article 8 the currency will be floated on the forex and will rise quickly.

      Delete
  45. LOL, GT5 said,

    " You've bought a piece of toilet paper that conmen have told you is a lottery ticket, BUT THERE'S NEVER GOING TO BE A DRAWING and you have zero chance of winning big."

    Now that's the best analogy of this scam I have ever seen, wish I had of thought of that one my self! There's no doubt about it this scam is exactly like a lottery that will never have a drawing and I can't wait until my cousin once again uses that line about people spending money on the lottery. I have a great come back now, thanks for that one and thanks for the big laugh I got when I read that!

    ReplyDelete
  46. DB continues to play both sides with his latest adoration of dontlop at DV:
    Posted Today, 09:23 AM
    donlop: .... It had a zero exchange rate at the central bank of KuwaitThe $3.45 official exchange rate went down $3.45 to zero
    DB: l think the Kuwait RV argument is closed. Markinsa and dontlop I think you both rock !!!

    Dontlop continues to not understand the difference between not being in operation or not accepting a currency and a 0 rate of exchange, and DB laps it all up.

    The key fact is that at no time during the Kuwait invasion, nor during the CBI Bremmer exchange of the Swiss dinar did either central bank raise the exchange rate past the ability of their reserves to cover the money supply. Iraq can not do so either. So even if you want call these events an RV, that does not imply the IQD RV is real. The whole argument about whether or not Kuwait RVd or whether or not the Swiss Dinar was RVd is just a logical fallacy. Its all irrelevant. Call them anything you want, the claimed IQD RV is still a myth.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Markinsa thinks that there's no proof that delete the zeros means lop even though people have shown him countless examples of other countries that did it. That should be enough right there to laugh him off. He's a joke and by far the biggest hypocrite on DV. He's totally clueless. He over there pounding his chest on his chart he posted when clearly there's a typo. Poor guy

      Delete
    2. "Markinsa thinks that there's no proof that delete the zeros means lop even though people have shown him countless examples of other countries that did it"

      I tend to disagree, in a way kinda, Markinsa and the vast majority really do know the truth but won't admit it, some see it clearly and won't admit it because of embarrassment at being scammed while others won't admit because they are in denial and lie to themselves then of course some are just blatant scammers. I just find it hard to believe that there are that many people really that stupid, but then OTOH just where else would you expect to find a greater number of the truly stupid gathered together in one place other than a Dinar pumper forum?

      Delete
  47. Well another one of Brian's posts just appeared over at DV and it handily debunks Markinsa and Dontlop's KWD "RV" argument, don't know how long this will continue because at some point the crooks running that site are going to start thinking that the damage from this will outweigh what they would incur from censoring it. If they start censoring at this point then a lot of folks will see what they are up to and it will reflect REALLY badly on them because it would be all to obvious what they are doing, trying to hide the truth. But if they just let it run then the pumpers there will start to look even dumber than they do now so what's there to do?. Even if it is decided to to try to squash the truth by deleting these posts I think that it will drive a lot of them here to see why the posts were eliminated, wow I think a few pumpers are in somewhat of a quandary right about now!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Alas I don't think Montana and his fellow pumpers have any problem with this. Just now there were 6 viewers in the "tank" at DV out of 199 on the form all together. That was the whole point of creating a forum where the faithful knew not to go. I doubt the posts will be deleted, but also doubt most DV faithful would even notice or care if they were.

      Delete
  48. I think a lot do but those that are afraid to venture there would most likely be hopeless anyway, they don't even stop to ask themselves what they would be afraid of but of course we know why. Then back in Aug one member posted,

    "Yesterday someone sent me to a website ************** which is hosted at blogspot. The blog has pictures and real names and other information on pumpers like Okie and the like. While I don't believe all the info released on that site I am hoping that there is some truth there. It would be nice to know the true identities of these liars. Has anyone here visited that site? I would like members takes on if the information is real."

    This was followed by several responses from DV members that admitted to coming here, some of them like Caz1104 (Hi there caz, I know you are lurking!!) said that what was put forth here is "biased and slanted", biased and slanted??? LOL, unlike the BS he spouts at DV I suppose. But then several others said things like,

    "i also was sent that dinar db thing.. it had video footage on it of a younger guy snow tubing with his friends, he sounded exactly like Adam Montana from the instructional sound clips on this site... the site mostly talked about how Adam is a fake character and how hes really going on vacations with his friends with the money everyone keeps sending him.. it was pretty deep and detailed definetly had me thinking.. kinda still does.. i dont know.."

    Also replies like,

    "My question to you would be ,why? I've been there and got a little freaked but my conclusion was, why let this stuff bother me"


    So apparently lot's of folks see this site and some do get to thinking because of it as evidenced by the first example but of course some tend to just deny to themselves such as the fella in the second example. Obviously the guy who started that thread was quite shook up about what he saw and I noticed that not long after posting that he seems to have vanished from the site, reading his other posts he seemed sincere enough but he also appeared to be getting a bit skeptical just before his last posts several weeks ago.


    I am not so sure about posting screen names here of the "innocent" members of that site so I just left them anonymous but that thread does show that this place here does have an effect, hey I learned of this site from some of the discussions at DV!

    ReplyDelete
  49. What I have learnt from this site and dinar vets. Your both biased in your opinions- I am still gonna keep my bet

    ReplyDelete
  50. There is far too much positive information on Iraq to not take a chance on the dinar. The only argument you guys have is the m2 numbers. Markinsa proved that something extraordinary happened with the Kuwaiti dinar.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Are you serious??!! You are truly insane DB. What positive info is there about the dinar other than forum facts that have no truth? EVERYTHING you have brought over on why you think it will RV has been destroyed. You truly need help.

      Delete
    2. At no time (pre war, war, post war etc) did the KWD rate go past the resources of their central bank to cover the money supply (for Kuwait this is usually M1 + part of M2). Same for the exchange of the Swiss Dinar by the CBI.

      That is the one simply formula you need to get. The rate for a pegged currency is dominated by foreign reserves divided by the money supply. It can always go down below that, but can't go much above it and the narrower and more fragile the economy the more that constraint dictates the rate. Iraq's economy may well grow nicely, but it won't make the IQD jump in value. It could easily go up a few percent over the next few years or down a few percent, but if you bought IQD for around $1000 per million you are looking a return of at best a 20% loss.

      Delete
  51. Can I ask you all a question - you lot obviously spend as much time as people who don't believe the dinar will lop. Why are you all so bothered? If I thought the dinar was a scam I would not be spending so much time trying to convince others it's a scam. I would move on with my life. I do think you guys have an agenda here - what is it?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. The agenda is to warn clueless people such as yourself that this is a scam. It's to help them not waste money or get family members involved over nonsense. Sam has been emailed many stories on how peoples lives were destroyed due to this. Get a clue already.

      Delete
    2. I don't like scams or the irrational thinking they encourage in people. The more people that know its a scam the better off we all are. Note also you still don't get it. It is not that "we think the dinar will LOP", but that it is certain it CAN NOT RV. It might RD (LOP), or it might not. That depends on decisions made in Iraq and we don't know what they will do, except that we know they can only pick from what is possible. An RD is possible so they might or might not do it while a huge RV is not possible.

      Delete
  52. Sam I am a question to you. You obviously have very good detective skills so it appears. Are you some sort of spook or FBI trained person. why have you gone to the trouble to investigate gurus and why have you publicly attempted to humiliate people or show people up in a bad manner. I do feel you are high up in an organisation and what's your agenda? Maybe I have a bad view of the human race but who cares this much?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Good lord, paranoid AND ignorant. Nice combo.

      DB, there are entire websites devoted to debunking scams, what are their agendas? The fact that if you yourself saw people getting scammed you wouldn't bother trying to help them really says a lot about yourself as a person.

      Delete
  53. I've heard rumours Sam that you were a mod on dinar vets and left due to being disgruntled - is this true?

    ReplyDelete
  54. I know this is an old article but, still useful in understanding the lifting of the zero's..




    Babylon University Study: Proposal to raise zeros from Iraqi dinar


    May 27, 2011

    Proposal to raise zeros from Iraqi dinar
    A. M. D. Jawad Kadhim al-Bakri

    Usually Matqom financial authorities of b (Ministry of Finance) by using the (fiscal policy) in order to maintain the general level of prices, in addition to the use of all productive resources available in the local economy to reach a state of full employment, as well as supporting the march of economic development, and this is done through the use of power financial instruments of fiscal policy b (government spending, and taxes).

    The Authority uses financial instruments to address these problems (inflation, recession, unemployment), which is usually self-styled (the gap inflationary and deflationary gap), which might be exposed to the local economy, in addition to their use is targeted to raise the level of growth in the country.

    Thus, the fiscal authority has no right to influence money supply and demand as they are the powers of the monetary authority of the Central Bank.

    History tells us modern economy that many of the countries of the world (which went through wars large Kaharpin Wars I and II or the collapse of their totalitarian as States of the former socialist camp) has proceeded to one of two things, either you change the national currency or remove a group zeroes them to return to the square of economic stability.

    In the U.S. experience in Iraq after the fall of the previous dictatorial regime has the Coalition Provisional Authority to change the currency of the new Iraqi currency, but equal in value, which would not intentionally CPA to raise the purchasing power of the Iraqi currency against the U.S. dollar or other currencies.

    This situation led to keep the Iraqi dinar is equivalent to (0.067) U.S. cents, which indicates a significant decrease in the purchasing power of the Iraqi dinar.

    If what has lift (three zeros) from the Iraqi dinar, it will lead to increase its value to the (1000) once calculated value Almertbip to the number of zeros that have been filed, any box of cigarettes that were sold (1000) dinars possible purchase after the lifting of the zeroes dinar and one, a thousand dinars and modern can be obtained by the A pack of cigarettes.

    In theory and when lifting (three zeros from Iraqi dinar), the purchasing power will rise to the U.S. dollar significantly to become one U.S. dollar equals (JD and a half) just so that the goods imported from abroad, worth before the lifting of the zeroes (1.2 million) Iraqi dinars, equivalent to ( 1000) U.S. dollars, will be worth after the lifting of the three zeroes (1200) Iraqi dinars, equivalent to (1000) dollars as well, and this will Igelb to remember any negative effects on the Iraqi citizen of the theory.

    Positives raise zeros from the Iraqi dinar: The process of removing three zeros from Iraqi dinar deliberate, according to a tight monetary policy will lead to the following pros:

    1. raise the purchasing power of the Iraqi dinar.
    2. revalue the Iraqi dinar against other currencies.
    3. increase the confidence of the Iraqi economy to foreign investors.
    4. increase the confidence of the Iraqi citizen Bammelth National, which has become comparable to other currencies such as the U.S. dollar and the Jordanian dinar and the Kuwaiti dinar … etc..


    This is another reason why I am taking that bet lads

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. He is talking about a redenomination of course. After an RD the new Iraq currency will be at 86 cents, pretty close to the dollar.

      Delete
    2. So your "proof of the RV" is an article describing a 3-zero lop like Venezuela & Afghanistan went through? Right...

      Delete
  55. So I'm either a paid anti-pumper, an FBI detective, or a disgruntled mod huh? LOL!!! Who I am isn't really relevant. People just want to talk about me when they can't get around the facts that I point out. I'm not telling people that I have contacts in the CBI or that I graduated from Harvard or that I made money on the Kuwaiti RV or that I hang out with multi-millionaires or that I am a banker or professional investor or that I received a purple heart after I was wounded in Desert Storm or that I was VP at JP Morgan Chase or that I know Dick Cheney ...... etc. When I expose people the intent isn't to humiliate them but to show people that they're frauds. I think investors have a right to know. The information that I provide is already on the internet. I just provide links to show people where the information is. If people don't want their criminal and/or shady pasts published maybe they shouldn't be promoting a scam. In time I will tell my story, but I will choose the time for that.

    My agenda is simple. I am a former dinar investor who learned the truth and set out to inform others. I think it's human nature to warn others when you see danger ahead. It pisses me off to see these douchebags exploiting people for millions and I couldn't in good conscience just walk away knowing that I had it in my power to make a difference.

    As for your Kuwaiti RV story, look at this. This is straight from the horse's mouth - the Central Bank of Kuwait. Just click on "Avg. KD/USD Exchange Rate" and look over the numbers. Do you see any big RV there? I don't.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. If you have nothing to hide tell us your story now Sam. I think its relevant who you are just like its relevant your agenda for exposing gurus.

      Delete
    2. DinarBeliever, Yup you're a GURU!!! It pains you so much to see GURU's exposed that you are now challenging Sam. That precisely is your motive for being here. You just let the cat out of the bag. See how low your IQ is??? You have zero interest in knowing the truth about WHY the 100,000% RV is a fallacy. Sadly you believe that you can utilize your juvenile tactics to fool the kind people here into believing you want to learn. Well surprise sucker!!! They gave you the benefit of the doubt to help you see the truth, not that they are the suckers you were and still are in the dinar RV scam. Joke is on you PING PONG!!! That's the sound your head makes when you get excited post reception of more BS info from the DinarVets circus act. Guess you all enjoy wearing Dunce caps and red rubber noses. SMH....

      BTW, I am not answering for Sam because he is VERY WELL capable of handling his own unlike Adam Montana and goons, but Sam clearly stated when the time is right. He has ZERO need to fulfill your demands just so you have material manipulate and deliver to your clowns at that DV circus claiming as a victory. If you haven't noticed, your DV buddies are talking about you and laughing so it's time you give it up at both forums or take a long walk off a short pier as you count your dinar.

      Delete
  56. DB are you totally blind? Can you not see what that is saying??? Get your head out of the clouds (or a certain part of your anatomy) for a second and LISTEN! Removing the zeros most certainly DOES raise the value of the Dinar and no one is saying it does not but here is where you apparently lose it, the NEW dinar will have 1000 times the purchasing power that the old Dinar had and the old Dinar will exchange at the rate of 1000 old to one new! Thus that pack of smokes you have referred to that cost 1000 OLD Dinar will now cost only 1 new Dinar BUT IT WILL STILL COST YOU 1000 OLD DINAR!!!!! How many times do THEY, not us, have to explain it to you? The old will remain at the same rate while the new will be worth 1000 times more, the value of the Dinar you hold DOES NOT CHANGE in the scenario you have posted there!


    Once again, the NEW Dinar will have a value of 1000 times what the Dinar had before the zeros were removed but you will have to trade 1000 of your old ones to get one of the new which will buy the same things as a thousand of the old!

    ReplyDelete
  57. Wow, this just gets better and better, I was kind of wondering if DB is trolling or really just that ignorant of the facts but I think that last post says a lot about him. He presents an article that clearly shows him to be wrong yet he crows about it because he thinks it's conformation that he's right, the best part is this is not the first time he's done this! I am nearly certain he is not a pumper since a pumper, goofy as they may seem, would not be dumb enough to come here with what DB has brought and make a total ass out of themselves like DB has done, it would defeat their purpose. Rather I am beginning to think DB actually does believe his warped way of thinking and is just simply doing as so many other delusional "believers" do and he just automatically discounts anything that don't jibe with what he wants to believe no matter how clear the truth may be.

    ReplyDelete
  58. Deep down a part of me knew all along you were an outright blatant troll Dinarbeliever putting on a fake front. From the way you started out with "w*nkers" to the way you post the same stupid questions every day, ignore all the answers given to you, post the same questions again, ignore all the answers given to you, run away from every opportunity at any sane two-way debate with your endless "answer a question with a question" diversion tactics, and repeat ad nauseum day after day after day. All your answers are in the past 200-odd posts over the past two topics. The reason you "can't see them" is because you don't want to see them out of fear of being wrong.

    Every question you've asked has been answered, every false claim you've made been corrected, every "report" you've posted been debunked. Over on DV you were boasting to your two little friends "dontlop" and "Markinsa" how you were going to "whoop us w*nkers" with your IMF link. Instead the reverse happened and your own "RV proof" was catastrophically destroyed with your own "RV evidence"! Your response? Run away in silence and pretend it never happened. As usual.

    As for your joke fantasy of Kuwait's "RV" : THE KUWAITI DINAR DID NOT INTERNATIONALLY CHANGE IN VALUE AT ALL Dry your eyes and deal with it. Yours, Markinsas, dontlops joint collective hallucination of "pretending" that "to cease trading must secretly mean fall to zero" is a flat out blatant LIE & mental delusion. It's as utterly retarded as claiming when the stock market ceases trading, "all stocks must fall to $0 because you can't sell them" It's a weird nonsensical schizophrenic fantasy already debunked on the Kuwaiti Central Bank's own website that only you three invented and fantasize about on DV, feeding each others ego's and telling each other want to you want to hear as some online comfort blanket.

    IF WORDS ARE TOO DIFFICULT FOR YOU TO UNDERSTAND EVEN WHEN POSTED IN CAPITAL LETTERS, THEN HERE'S A CHART OF THE KUWAITI DINAR'S VALUE PRE, DURING AND POST WAR:-
    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/2d/KWD_against_USD.PNG

    Your entire "proof" of your "RV" is "it must be true because me and my 2 friends desperately want it to be". That's not "proof" - that's an emotional cry for help. The rest of your increasingly deranged posts are just incessant babble trending towards paranoid delusions. Look at your latest posts. You're genuinely starting to sound mentally ill with paranoid accusations of anyone who disagrees with you must be a govt agent, and your constant clamoring for a "belief escape" rather than deal with the real world...

    In reality, what's happened is your whole "RV" has been totally, completely and utterly destroyed. Over and over again. This has upset you. In response, you are now lashing out trying to "shut up the naysayers" out of Cognitive Dissonance with a variety of juvenile pumper propaganda tactics including personal attacks, petty insults, character smearing and demanding people justify why they post (ie, a thinly veiled call for censorship when you can't get your way).

    Your latest posts absolutely wreak of pure fear & abject desperation. People post here because they dislike scammers. It's that simple. If you think that means everyone here works for the CIA, etc, then I can only suggest you see a good psychiatrist... For a long while I was prepared to give you the benefit of the doubt, but you've finally revealed your true colours and gone WAY off the deep end...

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Here's a recent post from DB over on DV. Apparently he has "libraries full of positive stuff" lol and that America has something big planned. Can you say delusional????

      Here's the latest:

      I am not embarrassed about a group of hornets waiting to jump on their victim - ok keepem I'm sure your one or a few of their members. I am going to keep posting as much positive stuff ok I have a library of positive stuff about Iraq - I am answering the lopsters but taking my time with it I will continue to post positive stuff about Iraq. I am going to take the original of dr Bakri's report and get it properly translated I will post previous stuff as well. There is plenty of evidence that America planned something big with Iraq so kiss my a@@ keepem walking on women funny!

      Delete
  59. Well I guess I need to apologize........I fell responsible for bring the DInarbeliever frustration down on us all. Hopefully we can all look at the bright side and know that hundreds of people witnessed him get utterly and totally destroyed by far superior intellect by the members of this site. It is now clear to everyone that Dinarbeliever is doing what every delusional dinar zombie does when they begin to panic after their defeat........resort back to conspiracy by insisting that the people who just punked them out are government agents who are trying to get everyone to sell their dinar so that Iraq can "RV". Its totally typical of the deranged "RV" mind. Really there isn't anything else to say about the Dinarbeliever episode. Brian has summed it up perfectly already. Anyone with even a quarter of a brain that reads this thread can clearly see that Dinarbeliever is way out of his league and has been completely debunked and frankly embarrassed on every single subject he has attempted to bring forward that he felt was "positive" about Iraq. LOL

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    1. I get a kick out of the Government agent non-sense and they're really grasping at straws with that one since no one is trying to get any of them to sell, what good would it do? I mentioned before just who would they sell to? Other delusional "investors"? Even selling back to the dealers the Dinar still just circles right back to the delusional so nothing would change. Of course they don't get anything right anyway so what would we expect them to think but I strongly suspect some truly believe it anyway. The fact is it's too late for the hopeless like DB and if it was just them then I would just laugh at them and let it go but it's those who are just getting in or those who are still wasting the rent and their kid's lunch money buying this worthless paper that I try to reach. People like DB, Dontlop, Markinsa, Caz and the rest of those delusional idiots know full well what the truth is and they know full well it's only a matter of time until they are once and for all finally proven wrong, they then will have to face friends and family that they suckered into this scam and they are afraid of this but there's not a damn thing they can do to change what's going to happen! In the meantime they run off at the mouth and try to act tough but it's really comical to watch the desperation in action, Dontlop being a prime example of what I'm talking about.

      Hey Dontlop, I know you come here so why don't you join the discussion and set us straight? Come on now a guy as "Smart" as you should be able to straighten out this bunch and help out your buddy Dinarbeliever.

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    2. Its the right thing to do to give folks the benefit of the doubt. Based on what DB posts here vs DV, his agenda is to pump not learn, but you can' know that unless you give him a chance. So no worries in my book Dinarck. Perhaps the interaction will be instructive to others.

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    4. Well DinarBeliever you sniffed me out. I'm a GOVERNMENT employee for the STATE I live in as an Insurance AGENT and just knew you would eventually catch on. Yes, I am a double agent. I go by AGENT 00086. Kind of ironic that the IQD exchange rate is the same number. Hmmm... Well I have a huge file on all dinar forum sites so that when it RV's I can sell all sorts of policies from Multi-million dollar Umbrella policies all the way down to insuring that you guys will not lose a dime in this wild speculative so-called "INVESTMENT" by insuring your worthless LOP'd camel crack stinking desert paper. But sorry I don't do trusts.

      Now let me be clear DINARBELIEVER. This was simply sarcasm and I do NOT sell insurance to protect anyone's currency so don't go telling people at DV or any other pumper site that their investment is protected. AGAIN,,, IT WAS JUST A JOKE OKAAAAAAYY!!!!

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  60. I posted this as a reply near the top of the thread, but I think it was too far up to get noticed so I'm posting it again.
    The Kuwait thing.... When Saddam invaded the central bank shut down along with every bank in the country. So during this time that dinarians claim the exchange rate went down (it never did, only the street rate dropped like has been stated a number of times) during this time the Central Bank and all other banks were shut down and didn't open until Saddam had be kicked out of the country. So not one single Kuwaiti dinar was issued by the Central Bank, or sold by any other bank, at a rate less than the official $3 something exchange rate.
    Again, because this is important. the Kuwait central bank did not issue 1 single dinar for less than their official $3 rate.
    The Iraq central bank has been issuing dinar for 10 years now for $.00086 or worse. They have issued 80 TRILLION of them at that rate.
    Anyone who thinks those situations are even remotely similar has a screw loose.

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  61. You guys are harsh - I will apologise to each of you if the dinar lops. If the dinar does RV will you guys apologise to me, dontlop, markinsa and everyone you have blasted?

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    1. Dinarbeliever the troll - If the Dinar "RV's" by 300,000% over the next year, not only will I give a groveling personal apology to you both here and on DV, I will in fact give you my house for nothing! Are you willing to bet your house that it will "RV by 300,000%" over the next year? No. Why? Because deep down you know the "RV" isn't real and never has been, you're just desperately trying to convince yourself more than anyone else. That's why you've resorted to weird elaborate fantasies of pretending that everyone else who "dares" to points out the blatantly obvious fallacy or posts 'unwelcome facts' "must be CIA".

      In reality there's nothing to "apologise" to you, Markinsa, dontlop, etc, for because their lies are already shown to be blatantly false. I'll repeat it - yet again - for you:-

      The Kuwaiti Dinar did not move at all in value internationally. The annual KWD vs USD values are in plain sight on the Kuwait Central Bank's website for all to see:-

      1986 - 290.53
      1987 - 278.86
      1988 - 278.94
      1989 - 293.74
      1990 - 291.24 <- Iraq invaded Kuwait. S3 KWD "replaced" with IQD
      1991 - 289.19 <- Kuwait liberated. S3 KWD replaced with S4 KWD
      1992 - 293.30
      1993 - 301.32
      1994 - 297.62 <- S5 KWD introduced
      1995 - 298.46 <- S4 KWD demonetized
      1996 - 299.42
      1997 - 303.36
      1998 - 304.79
      1999 - 304.38
      2000 - 306.79
      2001 - 306.54
      2002 - 303.97
      2003 - 298.07
      2004 - 294.07
      2005 - 292.00
      2006 - 290.20
      2007 - 284.28
      2008 - 268.54
      2009 - 287.72
      2010 - 286.64
      2011 - 276.01
      2012 - 279.91

      This is not a "subjective difference of opinion" which we're supposed to "wait and see" - it is OBJECTIVE FACT in plain sight on the CBK's website & every world-wide Forex exchange. Click on "Avg. KD/USD Exchange Rate" in the left sidebar of below link. No, really, stop running away and click it right now:-
      http://www.cbk.gov.kw/WWW/exchange_rates.html#

      Stop posting stupid sh*t day after day, switch your computer off, pick up your passport, travel to Kuwait and ask any Kuwaiti over the age of 40 what happened. The Kuwaiti banks closed and the KWD rate was frozen. Kuwait's peg vs the $ did not "change" or "revalue" at all. Just like when the stock-market temporarily ceases trading, all stock prices get frozen, they don't "fall to zero" as your dishonest confused friends falsely claim. Some people inside Kuwait panicked and paid over the odds *inside Kuwait* just like people in hurricane Katrina were panic-buying bottled water for $10-$20. But the KWD did not "RV" its peg vs the $. At all. And if you had bought £1,000 of KWD in 1989, they'd still be worth exactly the same in 1990 and 1991.

      We are not wrong because of a difference of opinion - YOU are wrong because you have gotten almost everything you could about Iraq & Kuwait (and currencies in general) objectively wrong and have resorted to telling long debunked lies about Kuwait, etc. Shouting those same confused lies over & over, louder & louder on DinarVets will not change the above facts one iota.

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  62. DB I'm about as new here as you so I suppose it would be out of line for me to suggest you just go away now but I was a lurker for a long time before my first post so I got to know and respect these guys a LOT, respect that you will never have! Considering how you have acted here you have been treated a heck of a lot better than you deserved but if you think keeping up your act long enough will eventually lure these guys into the very childish behavior that is so common place over at DV I can tell you, as one newcomer to another, you are wasting your time since these guys here are of a mature mindset and are a hell of a lot smarter than that crowd! Can't you see the difference between the replies you get here as opposed to the trash over at DV?

    You have served one very useful purpose in exposing others to the truth, just the opposite of what you tried to do but it worked out that way anyway because of you bringing up common myths and having them so easily and thoroughly debunked by irrefutable proof (proof that you chose to run away from instead of debating). It would appear you are trolling now, whether or not you were at the start, because you have no other reason for being here other than to annoy and try to stir up trouble. You have made it plain you know nothing about economics, math, the Iraqi Dinar or currencies in general and no amount of proof or logical explanation can get through to you, that is if you even believe what you yourself are saying anyway. You may or may not be sincere but either way you know full well the Iraqi Dinar " RV investment" is a scam and that you will certainly lose most, or even all, of any money you have invested but yet you continue with the utter non-sense both here and over at DV. If by now you can still ignore the IRREFUTABLE evidence that you have been shown and truly do believe that there is even the remotest possibility that the Iraqi Dinar can somehow defy all known economics, mathematics and just plain logic then I respectfully suggest that you have very serious mental issues. Once before I asked you to take a good look at yourself and once again I ask you to do so, go back and take a look at what you have posted on both forums and look at how many times you have been proven wrong yet you persist with the same things over and over. You have not "stirred up a hornets nest" over here but rather you have simply made an ass of yourself and become a laughing stock yet you keep coming back so you must be either trolling or you have absolutely no pride at all, it's pathetic and disgusting to see someone grovel like this and you sir have reached the point of being truly embarrassing!

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    1. And yet he is still on DV spilling nonsense about how it's undervalued and saying the cbi remove the zeros articles mean rv. The guy is truly an idiot. He has yet to come up with anything remotely intelligent and ignores the majority of questions he's asked. He has no clue what he's talking about and this point is purposely misleading members on dv

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    2. callingfoolsout,,, that is what a combination of anger and desperation resorts to. It must be really grinding him up deep down inside that he is not just a bamboozled speculator but a TRUE paranoid schizophrenic stuck in a psychosis state and even possibly bi-polar disorder. Remember he stated that he worked at a mental health hospital so either he's become a product of the environment over time or he IS an escape patient. Often times people with these mental disorders tend to be very creative / imaginative. With psychosis they fail to accept or meet reality for what it is. The only hope he has is RV comes through so that he can get a life supply of meds.

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  63. Omg... You guys need to hijack a conference call with this info. My mother is convinced this is happening and I'm like wtf mom.... Google. I admit, I was excited at first when she told me in the spring that it would happen soon, then spring went and summer came. Batman kept saying it will happen in a few weeks, summer ended. I tell my mom it's a scam. She is not listening. Every night, she is listening to these calls. It's madness! Who the heck is Batman anyway?!

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    1. T&C, I am dealing with a very similar situation with a cousin who is totally involved in this mess and will not listen to reason either. We are close, we grew up in the same house, so I can talk to him like the close family member he is but I still can't seem to get through to him. I tried without luck to get him to come to this site and see the truth for himself but he won't do it since like most Dinar Dreamers he is scared to death of the truth so I made copies of some of the discussions and presented them to him. He took one look at what was there and with the comment "you can find anything on the internet" he tossed them down like they were on fire! There is a glimmer of hope however, just yesterday he said something about the Adam Montana exposure article that makes me believe he has gone back and read at least some of what I gave him. Oftentimes a person will go back and look at proof of something when they're alone, something pride would not let them do when in the company of the person they disagree with. If you can't get your mother to come here to this site then try copying a few of the more "shocking" discussions and sit down with her to look at them, if she will not do that then leave them where she can find them as I did with my cousin and she may read them then just as my cousin seems to have done.

      Good luck with this and don't give up! I know it's an uphill battle but it's definitely worth the fight and with persistence and the information/help you will find here you will eventually get through to her!

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