http://www.ksl.com/?sid=25004930&nid=148&title=beware-amazing-investment-opportunity-in-iraqi-dinars-experts-say&fm=home_page&s_cid=queue-1
The response from many dinar investors is that it can't be a scam because they have made money on the dinar. Well, that's a possibility. If you bought dinar in Iraq in 2004 and later exchanged it for USD you might have made a profit. But if you bought from a dealer in the US at a 20% markup since 2008 you're in the hole. If you bought from a dealer at a 20% markup prior to 2006 you're ahead by about 6% until you try to exchange it, at which time you will take another hit. If you bought from a bank with only a 5% markup prior to 2006 you're up by 21% or so until you try to exchange, and since banks are no longer handling dinar you'd be forced to exchange through a dealer. The point is that any gains people have made by owning dinar have been mostly eaten up by markup, shipping, and exchange fees. Under the most ideal circumstances a dinar investor could have only netted about a 15% gain in a three year time frame which would equate to a return of a about 5% a year. When you weigh that against the risk from illiquidity is it really worth it? And let's face it. Most dinar investors didn't get into it for that kind of gain. They were looking for the home run scenario. The overnight millionaire dream. And that's the scam.
The very first post I did in September of 2011 was entitled "RV Reality Check", and in that post I said this:
Is the Iraqi dinar a scam? Well that depends on what you're referring to. The IQD is a legitimate currency. There are people out there selling counterfeit dinars or worthless Saddam era dinars so you have to make sure you're buying from a reputable seller and are getting the real IQD. You could easily be scammed if you don't. If you own the new Iraqi dinar and you go to Iraq you could use it to make transactions in Iraq just like you could use Canadian dollars in Canada or the Mexican peso in Mexico. So in that sense it isn't a scam. If you bought the dinar thinking that it might increase in value at a rate that outperforms mutual funds over the next five years I would say it's not a scam. But if you bought it thinking it would RV next week at 1,000-3,000 times its current value, then yeah ..... you've been scammed! And chances are it was by one of the douchebags we list on this blog.
So the only thing I called a scam was the big RV scenario where you could turn $1000 into $1,000,000 or more. If you own dinar because you think it will outperform mutual funds I would just call that a highly speculative investment, because at least that very unlikely scenario is possible. (Again, the CBI's policy is a stable exchange rate, so the only way to make a profit is if they depart from that policy for some reason.) I stand by that belief today. The only thing that I have been inconsistent on is the potential upside, because when I started the blog I thought that they were only backing about 25 trillion dinar and that they were reducing the money supply. I was also operating under the assumption that they were going to be allowed to monetize their natural resources. Based on those factors I concluded that they could only support 1-2 cents although I even considered that a longshot. As it turns out, despite all of the talk about returning to asset backed currencies I was never able to find one bit of evidence that Iraq is ever going to back their currency with anything other than their foreign currency reserves, and I now know that they're backing everything in their M2 (which is currently at 75 trillion and growing) with about $70 billion in their foreign currency reserves which would mean that they can't realistically support more than a tenth of a penny without a considerable increase in their GDP, a reduction in the M2, a reduction in the % in foreign currency reserves that they're using to back the dinar, or a combination of those factors. These discoveries contributed to my decision to sell all.
You'll often hear dinar investors say "how can this be a scam if XYZ bank was selling it?" Well if that bank sold dinar as a courtesy to their customers who are going to Iraq (where else are you going to use it?) then it's not a scam. But if they sold it by marketing it as an investment with incredible potential then it is. That's one reason the banks quit handling dinar. They were concerned about the liability they might incur by selling it to people who only want it as an investment.
Think of it this way. If you buy a bag of beans at a grocery store for $2, take them home, cook them, and then eat them .... is that a scam? Of course not. It's a perfectly legitimate transaction. But if that store advertises those beans as magic beans that can grow a beanstalk that will reach up to an incredible new land in the sky, and sells them for $50 .... okay, now it's a scam. Comprende?
Although I haven't called the dinar investment a scam there are plenty of entities that have, or at least issued some cautionary statement about it. Here's a short list:
You Can't Fix Stupid: The Iraqi Dinar Scam Lives
The Investment Scam That Refuses To Die
The Iraqi Dinar Scam / Fraud Prevention Unit
Washington State Dept. of Financial Institutions
Better Business Bureau
AMTFL Consulting Agency of Canada
Wisconsin Dept. of Financial Institutions
Learning Markets - The Iraqi Dinar Scam
Money Show: Why Won't The Iraqi Dinar Scam Die?
Scam Detector - Iraqi Dinars
Eagle Research - Iraqi Dinar
The Curse of Saddam - Iraqi Dinar Deals
419 Legal - Iraqi Dinar Scam
Dave Ramsey - Currency "Investing" is Ludicrous
Treece Advisory Corp
World Currency Watch
Wall Street Daily
Investment U - Is the Iraqi Dinar a Good Investment?
Iraq Business News
Debunking the Dinar
Salt Lake Tribune
Oklahoma Bankers Association
Idaho Estate Planning
Wells Fargo Advisory
Pacific Rim Bank
Bank of America
5th/3rd Bank
Federal Indictment of Brad Huebner, Rudolph Coenen
Okay, maybe that wasn't so short. It always puzzles me when people accuse me or others like me of being paid to bash the dinar or "reverse pump". Why would anybody pay me to say what all of these institutions have already stated for free? All I've done is put the information in one easily accessable location. And even more puzzling; why do so many people choose to believe the likes of unqualified and mostly anonymous "experts" on the internet and ignore the advice of identified, qualified professionals in banking, investing, government, and law enforcement when it comes to buying dinar, especially given the track record of fraud and deceit documented in this blog?
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Because people think these banking, forex, and investing professionals are all part of the gov't conspiracy to suppress the little guy. They all work for "the man". They're part of the worldwide banking cabal that's been raping and pillaging the world for years. It's laughable but a lot of people believe it. They think they're in on a secret. They believe it because they so desperately WANT it to be true. It's an alternate reality for them. I'm not a psychologist but I'm sure there is an official clinical term for it. The scam lives because it is a perfect storm of ignorance (how many people know anything about forex?), financial desperation (how many people really need a financial windfall?) and the internet (how much easier can it be to spread a rumor around the world in 30 seconds?). That's why people believe anonymous, nameless, faceless, clueless clowns that can't even construct a coherent sentence.
ReplyDelete“It's easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled.”
Delete― Mark Twain
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteSorry about the deleted and reposted comment, I'm having some wordpress credentials issues so I'll stick with google.
ReplyDeleteI'm wondering about the possibility of an FTC fraud action against dinarvets aka James Wolf aka Adam Montana. It would have to be based on charging for VIP services. Even if legitimate off-shore tax avoidance information is given, the context for needing such services, i.e. an impossible RV, is fraudulent and that might be able to bring in Wolf's many false claims of his own credentials. A long shot, but perhaps worth a bit of investigation. So does anyone know how much dinarvets charges for the various VIP levels?
I don't know how much he charges but I think a conviction is a long shot. Prosecutors would have to prove that Wolf knew he was selling a service that he would never have to deliver. Wolf may be a douchebag but I believe he is smart enough never to admit to such a thing. Perhaps Wolf had a private conversation where he let the cat out of the bag. That would be very difficult to uncover. I think most of these douchebags are smart enough to plead ignorance and claim that they were duped like everyone else. Civil suits by disgruntled subscribers may be a better option. They don't have to prove anything beyond a reasonable doubt. They just have to provide a preponderance of evidence. That may inflict a financial punishment but, sadly, they won't spend any time in the crowbar hotel.
DeleteI agree its a long shot. But I'm not sure they have to prove he knew the IQD could not RV. It might be enough to show he is offering services under false pretense of claiming he is a Harvard grad and that in a past career he daily dealt with C-level executives. But no harm in submitting an FTC complaint. But have to know what he is charing to do that. His flock will never go after him, even when the IQD redenominates, they will till think he is the greatest and it was all possible but just didn't happen.
DeleteI hope you're right. I'm all for these clowns answering for their deception. On a criminal level, I just think there are bigger fish to fry. In some ways, I have very little sympathy for the fools that continue to pay for that garbage. If they are that foolish, perhaps they deserve to lose their money. You can't fix stupid as they say. Some of the more outrageous clowns may do a perp walk but, I suspect most will quietly disappear. That's the beauty of the internet. One day you can be a middle east and dinar expert schlepping dinars and website subscriptions, the next day, you're not. Untraceable. Untrackable. Unaccountable.
DeleteI agree jail time is extremely unlikely. But maybe if any sort of official investigation is instigated it at least might make them think about closing down. I also agree that people who look for to good to be true returns sort of deserve what they get, but I also don't like to see folks taken advantage of, and looking at the "have to sell to pay bills" posts, that has certainly occurred.
DeleteI'm on the "now to September" timeline myself.
ReplyDeleteI'm on the "now to Never" timeline because it's not going to happen....
ReplyDeleteThank you Sam for the article and the information. The saga continues and the reason people accuse you or anyone of 'bashing' etc., is because most are too arrogant to think they could have been fooled, sad to say. i realized I was fooled within about 2 months or so. We bought on impulse before due diligence...dumb move but that is how we learn. It was evident that not only is the rv and rumors 100% scam, Iraq is absolutely going to demonetize then there will be a redenomination and a new currency, just as they have stated.
ReplyDeleteWhat still perplexes me about the whole sad scheme is how people call being lied to as being 'entertained'. Since when is being lied to considered entertainment? This is serious delusion and quite sad to see, especially at places such as DV where almost everyone sits for hours waiting for a new rumor to help them sleep. It is criminal and I hope over time there are more arrests and justice for those who have made a living off of mis-informed folks and all by lying to them. So few never seem to realize the only thing holding this scheme together is rumors and lies. 2014 will see the RD happen and I expect a new currency ISO to be evident by Sept. 2013. Then it will be game over and I hope people will be able to handle this because so many are in way over their head. :(
Thanks again Sam.....very well said.
ReplyDeleteThe whole scam part of the dinar saga is the made up fantasy that currencies can increase in value by 100s of 1000s of percent overnight. Pumpers created that lie years ago and have been making millions off of that deceit ever since. That is the scam. Can the dinar rise in value? Absolutely. Enough to make anyone a millionaire overnight (or ever)? No. It can never happen. The very fundamentals of economics prevent it. That simple fact is irrelevant to the dreamers though. Especially when they have cheerleaders like South West Pumper Guy and Easy Rider filling their heads with fairytales that sound good enough to believe.
Luckily it seems a lot of the dinar forum traffic is starting to die off. Hopefully the vast majority have woken up to reality. Lately DV has been holding steady with around 300 delusioned. This is a large decrease from the glory days of pumper mania when thousands were brainwashed into submission. I think that this site along with the brave few who spoke out as long as they could about the deception may have helped turn the tide in the SCAM department of the Dinar. That has yet to be seen but its pretty obvious which direction this "investment" is headed.
Unfortunately the scam artist seem to have gotten away with making a lot of money off of peoples ignorance including my own in the beginning. I was forced to sell my dinar back to Ali for a ridiculous markup (again). It leaves a bad taste in my mouth that he profited twice on me. Not only that, he turned around and sold my dinar to some other unsuspecting "investor" who will probably wake up one day and sell that dinar right back to Ali and the cycle of dealers getting rich while the "investors" lose money will continue. Hopefully Iraq will get it together and redenominate so this cycle will end and the dinar dreamers will be forced to get a job.
These poor souls who are buying into this crap. I see that Okie and Terry K are at it again, isn't this like the 20th time this year that "We're really close. Could be this weekend?" It amazes me that after 9 years of this BS, people still buy into it hook, line and sinker!
ReplyDeleteThe Reporter called this a scam. The people who spoke about it never stated it was a scam, just that it won't happen anytime soon. Yes, there are shady people out there making all sorts of promises that are wrong. Yes, there are those selling the Saddam IQD claiming it's value will increase, which is wrong. The new IQD has value... very little now. Will in increase in value??? Yes, over a period of time and NO ONE knows when it will begin its increase/decrease in value.
ReplyDeleteIf you go and cash out your IRA to buy IQD; If you go and spent the mortgage payments on IDQ; or spend your kids college fund on IQD... you are dumber than a rock and deserve to lose the money.
If you take a few hundred dollars and buy some IQD on the off chance that it will increase in value, then you are invested in it and you have not lost much if it goes nowhere in value.
scam (skm) Slang n. A fraudulent business scheme; a swindle. tr.v. scammed, scam·ming, scams
To defraud; swindle.
As the ranch owner stated, three people told him that they were about to come into serious money because they own dinar. They weren't just talking about an increase of 27% like we saw from 2006-2009. They were talking about the big RV which won't happen. The rancher said that these people have been "duped", which is another word for "defrauded" or "scammed". When Jay Adkisson (who was interviewed in this story) wrote about the dinar scam last year he did use the word "scam". And as I have pointed out recently, the CBI's policy is a stable exchange rate and the plan is to redenominate, so there's no reason to conclude that the dinar will ever be worth more than it is now before it is demonetized.
DeleteWhy do you assume it will go up in value? It is pegged to the US dollar. Unless they change the peg it will NEVER go up in value. And based on the premiums that people pay to buy dinar, it would have to go up 20-30% for someone just to break even. But there certainly are people getting filthy rich on the dinar. The pumpers and "money service businesses" are making a killing. I hate to burst your bubble but the dinar mania is the quintessential scam. You put $1,000 into it, wait a few years, get $800 out of it and think you've made money. It's no different than walking into a casino. At least in a casino, you know the house always win.
Deleteduck, The scam isn't the value of the Dinar or the existence of the Dinar as a currency - it's the deliberate, persistent and willful misrepresentation of a redenomination as a miracle "million dollars for nothing" mathematically impossible 'RV' by those with very obvious vested interests in selling Dinar via the outright fabrication of lies and sales materials that try to "explain" the exact opposite of what's happening using a huge variety of propaganda techniques:-
DeleteAd Hominem - "Anyone who disagrees with us is stupid"
Ad Nauseum - "The RV is true because we've said it 1,000x before"
Appeal to authority - "Donald Trump bought some Dinar so it must RV"
Appeal to belief - "Trust me, I'm a Christian. Lets pray. That proves my Dinar 'intel' is true".
Appeal to ignorance - "No-one can possibly know what will happen in a redenomination"
Appeal to ridicule - "Those who say there's no RV must hate Iraqi's"
Appeal to spite - "You should buy even more Dinar when you hear someone say there's no RV"
Bandwagon - "Lots of people have bought Dinar so it must RV". (NB: This was the main propaganda behind "Tulip Mania")
Begging the Question - "The RV must exist because every Dinar owner I know wants it"
Biased Sample - "My 5 Dinar owning friends said it will RV, so that's what the world believes"
Black-and-White fallacy - "Either the Dinar will RV or the world will collapse into the Dark Age"
Big Lie - "Iraq have said they will RV. The Dinar is backed by oil" (Truth : Iraq have repeatedly said they will redenominate)
Circular 'proof' - "The RV is real because I quote Dinar Daddy who quoted me"
Circumstantial Ad Hominem - "If you say there's no RV you must be a paid dumper making a fortune working for 'the man'"
Common man - "Trust me, I'm just like you!" (except for the $500k I've made selling Dinar...)
Confusing Cause and Effect - "Inflating Iraq's money supply 1,000x is the cure for a weak Dinar value" (caused by inflation...)
Disinformation - "Kuwait RV'd their Dinar"
Doublespeak - "To lop 3 zeroes 'really' means to RV, not to lop"
False equivalence - "Kuwait has a strong currency, so Iraq must RV"
Gambler's fallacy - "The Dinar will RV because all that bad luck in Iraq must mean a winning streak is imminent"
Glittering generality - "The RV must be true because we believe Iraq's deserve a high quality of life"
Guilt By Association - "You're wrong because you posted that on an anti-scam forum"
Half-truth - "There have been fewer bombs this month (true), so Iraq must RV (false)"
[cont...]
[Part 2 ...cont]
DeleteOversimplification - "The Dinar used to be worth $3 in the past, so it should still be worth $3 today."
Non sequitur - "Because the Dinar currency is legal, the Dinar RV must be true"
Poisoning the Well - "That guy who said there's no RV just got arrested for doing 31mph in a 30mph zone, so clearly he's wrong about everything"
Prejudicial Stereotyping - "Your opinion that there's no RV is worthless because you were born in x country or do y job."
Quotes out of context - "Shabibi said he will cut 3 zeroes. That clearly means 'RV'"
Red Herring - "Iraq have created 1,000 new jobs & built 3 new skyscrapers. That's 'proof' of the RV"
Rhetoric - "I stand for truth. So the RV is real"
Slogans - "Everyone's a winner", "why worry", "I bet you secretly own Dinar", "You're jealous of me aren't you", "Why do you post here?", "smoke and mirrors"
Special Pleading - "I don't need to prove the RV. I 'just know' because I'm me"
Straw Man - "The Dinar will RV - I mean look at the US budget deficit"
Two Wrongs Make a Right - "Oh yeah? Well people get sucked into stock-market scams every day"
Unstated assumption - "The Dinar must RV. An IMF report came out yesterday."
If someone sold you Microsoft stocks ($34.15 each at time of writing) with the usual "it might go up or down" and their stocks didn't go anywhere - that's not a scam. If they told you it would be $34,000 "this weekend", "imminent", "this year", week after week for 10 years solid, and made up stupid non-existent quotes by "high level sources at Microsoft", saturated in above propaganda, then that's a mis-selling scam. Just like the Dinar RV scammers are doing.
There isn't a single person here that doesn't know full well people aren't buying Dinar for normal 1-2% speculation on currency movements, they're buying into it on the back of absurd 99,000% "magical" profits, false promises, outright lies, and propanda that even Joseph Goebbels would be in awe of.
Wow! You put a lot of thought into that. Good job, Brian.
DeleteAnyone seen South West Pumper Guys recent "interview"? It is absolutely laughable. Supposedly he got to speak to some oil company giant. Obviously its all made up because it reads more like a conspiracy manual then an interview. He goes off on the "PTB" powers that be and a bunch of other stupidity. Whatever keeps the sheep from straying from the flock. Good little Shepard South West Pumper Guy. He keeps claiming that he is looking for economist to talk to but he would never interview a real one because that economist would laugh in his face.
ReplyDeleteAnyone ever notice that South West Pumper guy always avoids the 75 trillion and growing M2 issue. It's funny. All he does is pump the "wealth" of Iraq and its future economy like that has anything to do with their hyperinflated currency value. Lol
Both he and Kap avoid the money supply issue. They can't bs their answers to make it sound believable. However; since they both are mods at dinar detectives you will no longer have posts which directly question their opinions or their theories posted. They will be removed. Due to a broken "profanity filter" on the site, each post is reviewed. Laughable. They really prey on the ignorant. Bad excuse to protect the resident roos. Funny it broke over a month and a half ago.
DeleteYeah. Southwest Pumper Guy is the most dangerous of the pumpers in my opinion due to the fact that he is convincing in being "objective" in his reasoning about a huge RV and its possibility. Of course its all an illusion to fool the sheep into believing the shepherd has their best intrest in mind. Really you would never notice his deception unless you knew to look for it. He has everyone on DV fooled with the exception of the few who have yet to be banned for their scepticism.
DeleteYou seriously make me consider selling it all back. I was so excited when the business banker set me up with a business account last year using $100 (supposed to be $5k), it said dinar on the debit card. Even the bank manager came up to me. A year later, I wonder if this go-to bank is capitalising on the influx of people for new accounts. I had even told my friend, these gurus read like a bad dating scam from Ghana. Fortunate I am not heavily invested, but contemplating selling back...
ReplyDeleteI too have read the latest on DFI and CBI, stability is key and it does appear it will be an RI. The RI of 1-2% was set forth or at least appeared to originator from the IMF as a measure to stop gross currency manipulations. They (pseudo gurus) hinge much on the Basel lll banking regs. Yet these liquidity regs are simply to tackle the "too big to fail" essentially, imo, forcing them to make their own rope prior to being hung. There is much speculation about asset backed securities/currency. It is true Indonesia came out and said they would increase the currency, but "not by fiat". Germany also voiced the need of asset backed markers. Even within the IMF/BIS it has stated the ensuing need to curb currency wars and place substance behind these currencies. Where as I also found the report from the IMF encouraging them to bolster foreign currency reserves to help stabilize the exchange rate.
Perhaps when we are excited initially, we observe that which we wish to see. So what would you do? Chunk it in a back drawer and see the increase over the next 10 years or sell it back?
I cant believe you guys still care!
ReplyDeleteYou're still showing up and reading it Sonny1 so you must care that we still care.
DeleteYep, he even signs in as dontlop on dv and posts nonsense to keep the sheep in check over there. His lies weren't working as sonny so time to switch names. Wouldn't expect anything less from him.
Delete"I cant believe you guys still care!"
DeleteThis one clearly falls under "Slogans - "why worry"?" (scroll up to propaganda debunking posts above). It's basically the same personal attack that demands people justify why they join in a discussion in an open discussion forum, unless they agree with you in advance. Basically, a form of attempted ridicule-based censorship.
i plan to buy the iraqi dinar after it redenominates. the only reason why i say redenominate is because they constantly talk talk about it in like 99.9 % of their currency articles
ReplyDelete
ReplyDelete5-29-13 SwFloridaGuy:
Dinark, I'm afraid you're sadly mistaken. If you saw my questions they were I no way related to his responses, which is obviously out of my control. I already have several economic experts who are willing to give their their honest lined up who I have named and their full bio and credentials will be presented.
You said a real economist would laugh at me, another ignoramus statement considering that's exactly what I said happened to me at my last Oxford Club meeting.
Whether they romote a lop or a more favorable outcome for us is irrelevant. i am only after the truth and have attacked as many "gurus" as Sam, who I has actually forced me to further my own research and consider alternative outcomes.
If you read the post, you also read my comments saying although he is very well-respected, at this point in time we disagree, which leads me to believe you are severely deficient, have a personal vendetta against me or are just a genuinely bitter human being who will attack anyone know matter how scrupulous they try to be when presenting their information. You have no proof we will not profit from this, I have no proof we will.
But here's an idea how about we try to remain civil and admit there's a clear heterogeneity among dinarians and clearly obvious distinctions can be made between those who are pumpers an those (who right or wrong try to present solid research.
My opinions have obviously evolved since I entered into this investment, as have all of us, but I've been willing to learn from the false pretenses that caused me to initially sign up for this investment.
Sam does his homework and is obviously an intelligent person. However I detest the personal attacks which I have been victim of myself.
Yes, the frauds deserve to be exposed but until you are able to differentiate between pumpers and those who spend years doing research and simply express their opinion, I will have zero respect for the members (for the most part) who come here to cry rather than taking responsibility for their own financial decisions and blame those you now refer to as imbeciles.
But forget you took their advice prior to doing your proper due diligence, whose fault is that? Although, you claim to have aquifers and a high level of erudition.
I have never hid behind anonymity, have pictures up at every forum that I'm not banned from and belong to many dinarian facebook groups under my real name.
Have you Dianrk or Sam whose real name I wont mention. Which is not many for exposing certain prevarications, as does this site.
Here's my advice, try being a bit more discerning when it comes to who you attack. By the way, I challenge you to a debate. How about we commence after my next interview you are calling a fraud.
Kudos tto this site for exposing certain truths but keep in mind we can profit from this and when you try debating their information rather than personal attacks.
Makes you like childish and persnickety, considering the amount of time you spend reading what you consider a waste of time.
Sam this is not directed toward you, you'd have more class than to make such an imprudent accusation, considering I've devoted most of my time to debunking ridiculous rumors. Such as I did once again tonight with my Forex report.
Hello Dan. While I appreciate the compliment I have to take issue with you on the "personal attacks" remark. To my recollection I only posted about you once, and the jist of that post was a compilation of your past commentary on the dinar along with my rebuttal. How is that a personal attack? If anything that I stated is untrue I'll be happy to retract it and offer an apology. I've done it before and I'll gladly do it again if necessary. But since you never contacted me disputing anything that I said I had no reason to change it. I'm a reasonable guy. Just ask Neno, Sonny1, and miskebam. I removed Neno from the pumper page early on. I've taken heat from some of my readers for not calling Sonny1 and miskebam pumpers. I make every effort to be fair, knowing that my credibility will be called into question if I'm not. I have observed the evolution that you referred to and I commend you for that. Maybe your use of pumper lines in the past was done out of ignorance. That's understandable. I did that myself before I got educated about the dinar and currency. If that's the case and you now wish to disavow some of those remarks I'll gladly issue a clarification. But given the information that I had at the time I think it's understandable why I didn't make the differentiation that you suggest.
DeleteWell, I'm a real economist (PhD International Business, worked at a Federal Reserve Bank and Bank of England etc..) and I was banned at DV years ago for trying to explain years ago that the "wealth" of Iraq is really not much. Everyone goes on and on about their oil, and they do have a lot, but consider that in the grand scheme of things oil is simply a component of the more successful economies, and while energy makes up less than 15% of the US economy (and we supply a large part of that ourselves) it is 92% of Iraq's. The entire economy of Iraq is based upon selling a non-renewable resource and only a tiny part of it is from producing goods and services to use in commerce. That is not how a successful economy operates. Another thing to consider for all oil economies is that it is more and more likely that the US automotive fleet is moving away from gasoline and diesel to natural gas, a commodity that we can produce enough of to end oil imports altogether, an event that would lead back to $10 a bbl prices.
DeleteAnyhow, without getting into the actual argument, I was banned for bringing up some very important points, because they were true and not what the sheep want to hear. The "wealth" of Iraq and the size of their economy, along with many other factors that determine what the Dinar is worth is a more or less static figure, and that number divided by how many dinar there are is what one dinar is worth (this is very simplified, the actual explanation would take me 25 pages to write, not a few sentences).
And I just know you wouldn't interview ME, because I'd tell you the truth and the truth don't sell among the faithful.
Whispering that's another lie. Our site is consider lousy as if not more negative than this one. Show me one single post praising a guru. You're a bold faced liar who didn't have the courage to say that in the forum because you would have been torn to pieces.
ReplyDeleteKap is a guru. I have tried to say things against his "theories" yet they are either not posted or posted until he gets on and then removed. Go find those 15 posts which disappeared. The courage? Funny. We ALL have courage typing. Also funny you are so quick to call people liars. You sound like sonny1 now.
DeleteSam I am thank you for that respectful response. My house burnt down like 10 years ago. I lworked at a premier nightclub in SWFl and rented the first floor with my girlfriend. After the fire my boss and I went do some reconstruction. He left his silent alarm on and his dogs which I had rescued a few days before, google it and you'll see me in my boxers holding them and my face covered in ash. Anyway, we show up he leaves together tools alarm goes off I granny shotgun and run tithe neighbors screaming call the cops then put my tailgating down and waited. My boss shows up defending me and this 90 year old woman says I scared her and pointed the gun in her direction. Charges were dropped 10 days later but thanks for making blasting me all over the Internet as some psycho. This Is all public record so please remove me from your pumper group when I have done nothing but learn and support your theories although I must admit at the time you're lucky you didn't have a professional fighter as your neighbor. That's all in the past and I respect your intellect. Excuse the grammatical errors I'm on a cell phone. Once again, you have my respect for the manner in which you chose to respond. ThAnk you
ReplyDeleteSam, please forgive my grammatical errors as I was typing from my cell phone. If you don't mind I would like to pose a few questions to to you. Were you born with the ability to translate infinitesimal calculus. Whether or not Newton was the first to do so, that's quite an accomplishment.
ReplyDeleteOf course I'm being fecicious but my point is I worked in the security field my whole life, became a fighter, worked in for celebs in Hollywood then retired and moved to Florida where I knew nothing about Iraq. So, it appears we have something in common. Although we were not born with Rain Man's capricious gift of being born as an autistic savant, we do however have the ability to learn and adapt.
You love to bring up 3 year old articles where I have a more positive outlook and even was a member of OOM (yes I am ashamed), I would expect more than from you than a facile and clearly nongermane approach considering if I were anything like those you juxtapose along side me, it would mean I would have learned nothing.
Yet here I stand posting on a regular basis being called negative because I have done more research in 3 years than most people have in their life and realize what the real possibilities are, aren't and how little we know about the subject. The arrogance of those who spend a few months and call themselves experts offends me.
I'm not looking to get rich quick. I'm simply hoping one day Iraq recovers and we get lucky. Is that easy enough for you to understand, should I dumb it down a bit or would you prefer your minions to proceed a few more of their puerile remarks. I hold you in a much higher class than your followers. It's a shame really because under different circumstances I believe we could have become allies and learned a lot from eachother. Maybe one day that will change.
So, please remove me from your absurd pumper list until you can show me a recent post where I am promoting a guru or pumping. On a more positive note, thank you for exposing certain things I was not aware of. I may still wanna kick your a$$ for what you did until you fix it but I have nothing but respect for your intellect and certainly prefer you to the pumpers any day. Take it easy brotha.
Okay guy, you can put it back in your pants. First, you've never been included in the pumper list. You were only mentioned in Connecting the Dots. Second, one of the charges was uttered forgery so I don't see how that fits into the assault scenario. I think you can see how that might be relevant in this situation. However, as an olive branch I will remove the references to the charges and issue an update on that page. Your real problem though is with the site that displays the information that I linked to. As long as that information is there anybody can access it or link to it without knowing the facts.
DeleteI don't have minions. I have readers. Some agree with me more than others. That's the nature of blogging as you're aware I'm sure. Like you I am hopeful that we can have a less adversarial relationship. Thanks for participating in the discussion.
Dude, you've got some ego (and anger) issues. It took 10 minutes of "research" for me to know the dinar RV was a scam. When I learned there were 75 trillion dinar (and growing) in existence, I knew there was no chance that the dinar was going to RV. None. It is a mathematical certainty. That's more than 7 times the number of US dollars in existence (and our economy is nearly 70 times larger than Iraq). Additionally, when I looked at my original purchase order and realized I paid more than 20% over the face value to buy dinar, I knew I was duped. You don't need a degree in economics or 3 years worth of research to figure it out. You can pat yourself on the back all you want for your fantastic "research" but you have apparently missed the most glaring and obvious piece of information that exists. Go to the CBI's website if you need verification (unless you don't consider the CBI a knowledgeable or reputable source). You can thank me later for all the years of additional research I just saved you.
DeleteI'm sorry if I came off a bit bellicose. It's been a long week. I truly hope that you retain the integrity you claim to and hope you enjoy the rest of your week.
ReplyDeleteThank you for the classy approach you chose to take. The site I'm affiliated comments on rumors the same as this one does. If you read the responses you will find analogous comments that are almost word for word the same as you receive here. The only difference is we don't allow attacking them on a personal level because we don't know them well enough to do that and because of the possible legal ramifications.
DeleteDefamatory statements made against an individual or corporation can easily be proven in court that the defendant said or wrote the statements; the statements are not true; the statements caused harm to he/she harm, by damaging their reputation and of course other people heard or read the jaundiced statements.
Obviously, their attorneys will collect multiple copies of the statements made against the victim and proof that the defendant is the one who made the statements.
Gather documentation of the harm they have suffered -- this includes proof of how people treat them and harm their business.
They will obtain written statements of witnesses (third parties) who either heard or read the defamatory statements made by the defendant. Also, you never know when you are attacking a brand or name that has been trademarked and when profits are made from using them, whether that be from google adsense etc., this could easily lead to judicial problems down the road.
For this reason, in addition to the moral aspect, is why we choose to dispute the information and steer clear of going after them personally. You know we're not a pumper site, you've seen our members and read our responses. I also feel that those like BH Group got exactly what they deserve as well as anyone who manufactures rumors for their own personal gain. Anyway, thanks for the chat, the courtesy you've shown me as well as removing me from that list. It was a pleasure speaking with you.
You want to debate me? OK.....there is no such thing as large RVs. If you disagree then please show us one. End of debate.
ReplyDeleteMaybe you can go on a huge speal about currency appreciation shocks or lie about the BIS setting exchange rates again but you need to realize that the people on this site can think for themselves unlike your victims on DV.
Lol.....the hint of defamatory lawsuits. Typical pumper threat. Only in dinar land would people speaking out against the con artist be considered criminals while the con artist themselves be considered the victim.
ReplyDelete"Lol.....the hint of defamatory lawsuits. Typical pumper threat."
DeleteIndeed! Most "defamed" guru's, pumpers and "pseudo-pumpers" (who regularly aggressively recirculate fake rumors / false economic concepts then protest "I'm not a pumper!"), do not want to go anywhere near a courtroom in reality. Although the BH Group case was mostly about their Dinar hedge fund, if you read through the court statement, they utterly demolish the usual "RV" pumper claims from all aspects (RV vs redenomination, EO 13303, "US Treasury holds masses of Dinar", etc), and find them equally guilty of ("...materially false and fraudulent pretenses and false misrepresentations...")
"The truth of the allegedly defamatory statement will always negate the claim (whether because the plaintiff fails to meet his/her burden of proving falsity or because the defendant proves the statement to be true)"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_defamation_law
In other words, if someone makes a personal accusation against a guru of "liar", "conman" or "defrauder" for saying Iraq will "RV", in order to be defamation, the guru's must prove all of their own claims are true (which they aren't and never have been) and have instead already been debunked by the same courts the guru's hope to win a "defamation" suit in and by over 20 official CBI contradictory statements themselves. Even those who genuinely believe what they're saying and are naive rather than malicious would still lose the case. Truth is an absolute defense to a defamation claim, and all the defendant has to do is quote what the CBI are actually saying about Iraq's redenomination, and quote the prior BH Group court case notes, and any defamation lawsuit is lost already... which is why there haven't been nor are going to be any successful "defamation of character" lawsuits by Dinar guru & pumpers against their critics, or why none of the pumpers on Sam's list will sue him - they will lose.
If anyone has anything to fear from defamation lawsuits, it's the pumpers themselves who regularly make empty conspiratorial claims such as "x person / agency is holding up the process", etc, when in fact they have nothing to do with the process.
Again........well said Brian.
DeleteHow can he say he regrets making these statements when one of them specifically says he has a contact at the IMF...and then quotes him...doesn't really sound like an opinion...sounds more like a lie.
ReplyDeleteHere's a few quotes from SWFG:
4-16-2012 I am very encouraged and I…do believe we are close. Without going into any details, I will say that I have been in contact with an economic counselor who works for the research department of the IMF and he has confirmed that Iraq is moving forward with their currency reform project and among the issues being addressed is the raising of their exchange rate
I never said there was one instance of "large RV" or proof that there ever will be. So, considering that I accept your debate.
ReplyDeleteI already responded to you but it wasn't approved. I never once that a large RV has ever occurred. In fact, I've said the complete opposite. I've listed every RV that occurred in the last century and even made the comment that most economists consider a 100,000% RV impossible. However, I have also said that if any country has the ability to accomplish a significant currency appreciation its Iraq. They have several ways other than a RV of accomplishing this. Does that mean they will? I have no idea, I can only hope they do.
ReplyDelete@SWFG: People are losing money, perhaps putting themselves in a precarious financial position, because of you and others of your ilk that perpetuate lies about the Iraqi Dinar. Either you are dangerously naive and egotistical, or after some sort of profit. I have watched you go from some-time commenter to guru status, so you clearly have a motive. Please, just stop.
ReplyDelete@briansimpson65: Thank you for taking the time to present the logical fallacies used to further the Iraqi Dinar myth!
You must have missed the hundreds of posts where I exposed bogus rumors to protect investors for the exact reasons you mentioned. You are entitled to your opinion and if you have something against me I can handle it just fine. I get hundreds of hate mail from gurus bashing me for being negative so I'm used to being attacked. Wish you the best of luck in the future and I understand how frustrating this can be so I don't take it personally.
DeleteSorry guys. I've been away from the blog for a few days and am just now looking over the comments. I'll try to stay on top of things.
ReplyDeleteI get that some on here want to save the world, but at this point in the dinar investment, with as much plug as it has gotten, for someone to believe or form an opinion on if it will rv or not by what someone says on a dinar site today is crazy. everyone by now has the knowledge to not believe anything they read on the net. its sad to me that the only truth we get is from a site that brings up negatives (sam's site) which imo, sam is doing a great job. I have been in this as long as anyone, and I have been wrong as much, if not more than anyone, but if someone believes what they read on the net of a $3.00 rv its kinda there fault at this point. good job on the site sam, as you know I am a fan of what your doing. and callingfoolsout, I am not trying to start another pissing match with you, because its pointless, but I dont really go on the sites anymore, and I am not dontlop, I really dont care about the internet-dinar world anymore, I come on sams site to see who got-got so to speak. but i really dont care anymore...
ReplyDeleteSonny, I got your back bro.
DeleteLol, a fraud has another frauds back....how nice of you.
DeleteCurious why you keep making these statements as I can't find anything to substantiate them...from what I have read Romania was a train wreck in the 80's which lead to a RD in 2005.
ReplyDeleteRomania 1980/1982 47.50% - 35.40%. At the beginning of the 1980s, several step appreciations of the commercial exchange rate were taken.
Read more: http://dinarvets.com/forums/index.php?/user/46906-swfloridaguy/#ixzz2VOBGPSqX
largest previous RV in history was Romania at around 40%. So, although Iraq has far more potential than previous countries who RVd, let's keep things in perspective.
Read more: http://dinarvets.com/forums/index.php?/user/46906-swfloridaguy/#ixzz2VOBwlms1